juniorz1

I agree. AW was fantastic in the 70's since the Frame's and Matthews were all in play and the introduction of the Corys. After 1980, the offspring characters of those families were in play and in the middle 80's completely gone. Harding Lemay returned back in late 1988 bringing back the characters he created. Iris came back to Bay City, The Frame family started to come back, Russ Matthews returned to town. Donna Swejeski did a great job crafting the familes again but I think it was Harding Lemays stuff she was scrpiting from. He did not stay long after his return. After the 25th anniversary special, that was the death of the show for me. All the familes back out of the picture again and silly characters created

You have the timeline all wrong. Lemay returned for all of 2 months- from September '88 to November '88. Then the writers' strike happened and Donna Swajeski took over. Lemay never came back. The 25th Anniversary didn't occur until May of 1989- Lemay was LONG gone by then and there's no way he drafted stories 8 months in advance during his 2 month stint. Swajeski is 100% responsible for those episodes.

I think the Laibson/Swajeski era on AW is viewed favourably because it was the only period post-Lemay/Rauch that AW had any stability in that department, although it did not translate into such success. AW was hurt by a dizzying turnover of writers and producers over 20 years but until JFP took over, the show kept its realistic depiction of social classes and character focus even through the regime changes. The quality level was sometimes great, at times less so, but it was never near the worst shows on air.

Oh I just love the bolded part so much that I had to quote it. SO true.

I thought it was a bit sad that they left Nicole in that institution for good. The character didn't deserve that.

I really liked the last MJ (I haven't seen much of the first MJ), I wish they'd kept her around. It seemed like she was one of many female characters on the show at that time who suffered from DePriest's need to write female characters in a degrading manner.

I know this is an old post, but I had to comment on it as I re-read this thread. If you'd seen Kathleen Layman (the 1st MJ) in the role, I think you'd have a different opinion. First off, she very much resembled Julie Osburn's Kathleen, to the point that they really could have been sisters. Secondly, she was a completely different character than Sally Spencer's MJ- she was tough, feisty, smart, spirited, and certainly nobody's victim. Sally's MJ was kind of the polar opposite of that- it was quite jarring and I never warmed to her in the role. To be honest, as a young kid, I liked Layman's MJ every bit as much as Kathleen.

Plus, she had FANTASTIC chemistry with Rick Porter's Larry. Unfortunately, the show never had the guts to go there with them, since he was married to town sweetheart Clarice.

OMG, those 1987 recaps are AMAZING!!! Thanks so much for posting Carl. This is right when I started watching- I was only 8 but I picked it up with my Grandmother after SFT went off the air. It never clicked for me that Colleen Dion played Cecilia, though she always seemed so familiar on B&B and AW that it makes sense now. I remember so much of this- Lily setting her sights on Jack, Ned finding out April was a prostitute, Rick Webber's arrival, Cec hiding the miscarriage- such GREAT stuff. Gosh, if only SoapNet had re-aired Loving instead of Ryan's Hope. What could have been.

Sadly, I think it may have actually caught on, moreso than Ryan's Hope did, and even built a lil audience on Soapnet, especially if they started right around this time. It was always such a solid, consistent show when I watched (87-92, St Louis didn't air it when I moved there). And what REALLLY sucks is there isn't much of it online to ever whet my appetite.

I'm really missing ATWT right now. They had my favorite cast of characters of any show for the past 10 years and I miss them all dearly. Days, Y&R, and B&B don't compare and, when I tune in now & then, OLTL, AMC, and GH don't either. I'm no stranger to cancellation, but I guess ATWT's is hitting me moreso than AW and even SB on some level because there's no show I can tune into that will take it's place. Or even ease the pain for that matter.

It's pissed me off A LOT lately when I read on the boards that ATWT and its actors shouldn't have submitted themselves for 2011. The show was far and away the best soap of 2010 and they had the best cast in daytime right up until the end. Even with all that JPiss (everyone blames Goutman, but it was her lazy writing that drove the show into the ground for years!) did to kill the show, there was still always something that was uniquely ATWT about it. I miss the hell out of it.

Got any more articles Carl?

Phew. I thought this thread had disappeared and was replaced by the old one. SO glad I was wrong

Have you looked for S3 online?

I have and all I can find are disjointed clips on youtube. If you could link me to a site that has them, I'd be very grateful.

Ugh, that sucks about RHONYC being postponed. They're easily my favorite cast, though my fave housewife, Bethenny, won't be on anymore. Having not seen season 3 at all, I was looking forward to the marathon of repeats the day of the premiere. It SUCKS that CW only showed S1 & S2 and Bravo never repeats it at all. Hopefully, I'll get to see it soon.

I remember The Wizard of Oz fantasy- I'm pretty sure it was when Lisa Peluso was playing Ava. Actually, I'm positive because Ava was Dorothy and Jeremy Hunter was one of her 3 companions, I'm thinking the lion. Not positive, but I think I remember Randy Mantooth's Alex was the Scarecrow. Not sure about the Tin Man. Is any of this right Carl?

Agreed DF. How annoying is it that every time Kim and now Andy brings up the fact that Taylor clearly stirred the pot when she went up to Camille's room, Taylor deflects by saying that Kim didn't have Kyle's back in New York? It's beyond tiresome and I can't stand it that NOBODY is calling Taylor on her BS when she instigated this whole thing AND fanned the flames.

You know, I know that Celeste Holm is an Oscar winning actress and all, but I just never warmed to her on 'Loving'. To me, Augusta Dabney was the only Isabelle Alden, but I even preferred Patrica Barry's Isabelle to Holm's version.

Does anyone else remember that there was a painting in the Alden mansion- I can't remember if it was of Isabelle or of Cabot and Isabelle- but it was in the main living room and that they made 3 different versions of the painting while each actress played the part? Can someone back me up or am I totally crazy?

Aww, thanks for posting that Carl. I just LOVE her. I was devastated and at a loss when AW let her go. It's a shame she hasn't done much since. I don't care how many years Judi Evans played the part and how popular defining she became- Cali Timmins will always be the true Paulina to me, much like Deb Adair is still my Kate, despite Koslow having played her for like 14 years.

You're so lucky to have those! Though I really am more interested in episodes from 85-88, watching the first year is fun for me because I've never seen it.

I DVRed it, so now I'm excited to watch.

I'm SUPER-PISSED that they're not showing RHONYC season 3 repeats now- they switched to Orange County! Damnit, I'd never any of the episodes and just got through season 1 & 2 through repeats and was SO looking forward to S3. Damn you CW! :angry:

I'm watching the NYC repeats too and I'm with ya on the Bethenny LOVE! Will post more after I watch pt 2 of the reunion! Oh, and I love it WAYYYYYY more than Beverly Hills- these women have all sorts of personality and senses of humor.

Wow! If Miranda was after Mac, that means McConnell must have shared scenes with Vicky Wyndham. I'd have been very interested to see their work together- I could very much see them being a formidable duo.

Poor Judith though. I think every show she's ever been cast on has made her play older than her actual age. You would never guess she was in her 30s in the pictures from AW which seems purposeful considering the character & storyline description. And then on Santa Barbara, she was in her early 40s and clearly, the character was intended to be well over 40. I believe they even had her dye her hair grey, as they did the same when Jed Allan came on as CC.

I was wondering if you or anyone else would be interested in any of the stuff when Ellen Wheeler and Tom Eplin were together in real life; they were interviewed and on the cover, in 1986. I didn't know if someone might feel that was too much about their personal lives and are only interested in the characters.

If there are any actors you're interested in let me know and I'll try to find something.

Yes, I'd be curious about that stuff. I wasn't reading the soap mags at the time and the whole Eplin/Wheeler thing is something I've always been curious about.

I was going to ask you, were there any AW actors you wished had been on Santa Barbara, or vice/versa?

In my fanfic, I cast Victoria Wyndham and Charles Keating as new characters, so them. I think a menacing Keating would have fit right in on SB. I also think that Lisa Peluso's humor and Anne Heche's raw talent could have definitely added something to SB. William Grey Espy would have been a good actor to bring over and pair with Sophia or Gina. I also would have been interested to see Alicia Coppola take on BJ and think that Cali Timmins would have made a FAR better Kelly recast than Eileen Davidson, since the Dobsons clearly wanted to do away with my Carrington. And, not that it ever should have been done, but over the years, I think a blonde Julie Osburn may have made an interesting Eden recast.

But my BIGGEST wish, which is why I cast her that way in my fanfic, is that Carmen Duncan had played the role of Pamela Capwell Conrad. I think she would have been PERFECT for the part and much better suited than Marj Dusay or Shirley Anne Field were.

As for SB actors moving over to AW, I think Lane Davies would have been great over there. I think he could have had much chemistry with any number of the AW vets- Donna, Felicia, or even Rachel all would have been great with him. Nancy Grahn is another one who would have been good. I think she would have made an interesting Nicole Love recast. I also think Carrington Garland would have made a very effective Amanda or Paulina. And while there were rumors of Mason & Julia being sent over there, I think Robin Mattson's Gina and Justin Deas' Keith would have been better choices to jettison to Bay City.

How many actors did the shows share anyway? It doesn't seem like that many.

To tell you the truth, I'm hard pressed to think of ANY actors the 2 shows shared. Come to think of it, I believe Judith McConnell was on AW back in the day, but that was before I was born.

I'm just caught the last half of S1 of New York on CW and I gotta say, I LOVE these bitches. Constant controversy, they say what's on their minds and don't hold back- I appreciate that far more than the fakeness of most of the Beverly Hills girls and the loony, batsh!t psychotic antics of the Jersey women. My favorite changes each episode, but so far, the rotation has been Jill, LuAnn, and Bethenny (though the S2 opener had Ramona moving up on my list). The only one I absolutely CAN'T stand is Alex. She reminds me of the snooty neighbor from Roseanne, turning her nose up, yet forgetting she lives next door to the very people she's turning it up to.

Seems to me that Alex & Simon have all sorts of delusions of grandeur.

I miss all the AW chatter. Cat, aren't you watching anymore?!?

No need to be defensive, I wasn't being nasty. "On the payroll"... So apart from any possible sexual favours, he is also doing other stuff for a "pay"? No?

You think everyone is as happy as they can be in that triangle? A woman paying another man for "favours", another woman seeing all that and being absolutely fascinated and entertained by it and a man "doing favours" in return for money? Isn't it fabulous?

I don't think anyone is happy as can be in any real life situation. I'm just not so sure that's the case here, thus why I said 'funny', not 'happy'. There's cameras involved, Nick and his wife are career actors, and Camille is clearly trying to use the show as a springboard to her own future endeavors.

My point is it's not all black and white, especially in Hollywood. Sure, the drama is amped up on the other 'Housewives' shows, but I think there are larger kernels of truth there. On this edition, I'm far more skeptical of EVERYONE, but Camille- and Nick by default- are fascinating because she's so f*cked up that it's kind of hard to tell where the lines are blurred and to whom they are blurry.

I wasn't being defensive, merely trying to clarify myself without being so direct and obvious about it.

LOL! So you are saying he is a gigolo? I LOL-ed, but it really isn't funny to any of the parties involved, I'm sure. I don't even want to go into this discussion because something about their relationship seems... off and one of the reasons has been listed in one of the previous posts when Nick was mentioned. I don't want to start insane rumours and wild speculation.

I didn't say 'gigolo', per se. I believe I said on they payroll. Big difference. And, quite honestly, I wouldn't be surprised if it is funny to all parties involved, save Nick's 2 year old.

I also wonder whether Kelsey's really dumped Mauricio as his realtor. Which reminds me: can Camille pronounce words correctly? And what does she have with Nick?! That relationship is weird and I'd appreciate it if someone shed a light on the whole matter; she is a horrible b!tch, but he looks all opportunistic and dishonest somehow.

My guess? I think Nick's on the "payroll," if you know what I mean. That scene with them all dining outside with his wife smacks of hot, out-of-work-actor-in-need-of-money-and-wife-willing-to-let-him-do-what-he-got-to-do-to-make-it. Though, I don't know how long I'd allow it to go on (if at all) with a loose cannon like Camille.

Oh, and so you know, the Gods have ordained that we can again say bitch without it showing up [#@%0#]. Just like them people on the teevee.

Who is that Cedric guy? And why is he her permanent house guest?!

Cedric is amazing. LOVE him!

Oh I'm under the assumption that those two have been copulating like bunny rabbits for quite some time now.

Indeed.

But I would like to see it for myself.

Gee, thanks for reminding me of "The Thing that Ate Santa Barbara in 1992" (Zimmah's Jodie), Carl.