Videnbas

I agree having Deacon, Sheila and Taylor back is good for the show. If done right, it could be a kind of reset to the last time the show was good (this combination of characters feels very 2001-2002, and the storylines that are revisited now are also from that period - Breacon and Sheila shooting Taylor). By the way, I'm only just catching up on December episodes, and although I like that the focus is more on the legacy characters now, some things in the dialogue just make me go "huh?". Taylor feeling honored that her grandchild Hayes was named after her? Ridge asking Hope to move out and Brooke going "this is my house!" - and Ridge NOT replying (or remembering) that he's the one who bought the house for her. Taylor the scientist talking to Ridge about how she has no idea what an "elliptical orbit" is - and neither does he. But on the whole, I like this shift back to the "core" of the show.

To me, right now the only one that captures my attention is KB to be honest. Her screen presence is in a league of its own, and her scenes with SK are my main reason for watching right now. Other than that, I am pretty indifferent to the rest. They are okay for the most part, but I don't miss them when they're not on and I don't find their characters very compelling.

Merry Christmas to all of you! 1994-1995 was my favorite period too. I was hooked on the Princess Leyla storyline and the Thorne/Macy storyline. I was thinking and this question came to mind: If you could pick just one character-defining scene or storyline for each major character, that is, something that captures the essence of who they are as a person, what would it be?

B&B: When I watched Thorne and Macy's wedding party from 1995, I remember actually thinking at the time "this could be the end of the show". We'd just had a lot of major storylines that had all wrapped up during the summer (Sheila's reign of terror, Ivana's murder, Taylor's back from the dead storyline and Ridge finally choosing between Brooke and Taylor), and there weren't really any new storylines that had gained any momentum at that point. Also, three major couples on the show had just been paired up or were heading in that direction (Eric/Stephanie, Ridge/Brooke, Thorne/Macy). It's the only time in the history of the show that I recall where it could have ended without any major loose ends, and with a scene where the entire cast was present and celebrating (it was one of the few weddings on the show - possibly the only one - where all the characters were invited and everyone present actually supported the marriage). Sure, we'd have missed some good stuff between 1996 and 2002, but I do feel the tone of the show shifted a bit in those years and there really wouldn't have been a natural end point before the show started going downhill in 2003. If written a bit differently, the Portofino location shoot might have been that end point (as it was IMO the last truly great moment of the show), but as it was, it couldn't have ended there because too many bombshells were dropped then that needed to be followed up back in LA.

What? Are you sure? I never even noticed!

That happened because the uploaders don't have the correct air date for Season 1. Every episode from July 1987 and onwards in the Season 1 playlist has the wrong air date. Agree about Margo! She is a truly grey character and quite an interesting one.

I think Bill Spencer didn't have a lot of villainous traits at first. He was just an overprotective father and a powerful man. His grey sides were more developed later on, as we learnt about his secret magazines and the shadier side of Spencer Publications.

I am currently watching February 1991 and the end of Jake's abuse storyline (and I must say the final episodes are very suspenseful!) and I'd really like to hear your reactions to it. I think the show did really well handling an extremely dark and difficult subject. I'd also like to hear your views on the Julie Delorean subplot. To me, there's just something I don't quite follow regarding Bill Spencer's motivations here. What exactly was his goal in having Julie go after Clarke? Why did he want to finance Julie's business with Clarke? The root of all this was his desire to stop Sally from blackmailing him (or get back at her for doing it?), but from there on I'm having a bit of trouble connecting the dots. Also, the scenes with Stephanie and Ruthanne (the homeless storyline) are just riveting. But I had to suspend disbelief a bit as to why they didn't manage to clear everything up when they first went to the police (by telling them about Stephanie's car being stolen and her being robbed, and showing them her torn clothes and wedding ring).

Yeah, I noticed the fan wars too! I think it's a bit sad really when the complexity of a storyline is reduced to fighting over who Ridge loves - it's kind of missing the entire point of the storytelling. I didn't know what a shadow ban was either, until I noticed my comments were only visible when I was logged in on YT and I started Googling why that could be. The funny thing is, I was not the only one who pointed out that the Christmas episodes had the wrong dates (because the uploaders didn't take into account the preemptions of 1987), and the uploaders never corrected the dates but just kept labeling obvious Christmas episodes as having aired early December. And fans were commenting on it like it was a bizarre 80s thing to have Christmas episodes take place on the wrong day... I do think the quality of the discussions is a lot higher here than on YT or any of the other B&B message boards. No fan wars and more people interested in having in-depth conversations about the show and characters. I wouldn't say Bill Bell wrote any of his main characters as clear-cut villains. But Bill Spencer is certainly a morally dark grey character. His motivations are not entirely villainous (usually either protecting himself or his daughter), but he does bend the rules quite freely to achieved his goals.

Oh, one that I forgot... B&B, the storyline with Jake's abuse in 1991 where the major plot twist was how Jake mistook his uncle for his father. The casting of Jake's father and Jake's uncle - AMAZING. They managed to find two actors so similar in looks and voice that this major plot point didn't take any suspension of disbelief at all. They looked like fraternal twins.

Makes sense - I checked one of the episodes and it was Hope's birth.

I made a comment on a 1987 episode on the official Youtube account a few weeks ago, and to my amazement I just realized I have been shadowbanned from Youtube ever since! (All I did was comment politely that the episode dates were wrong, hardly offensive by any standards. Could it really be that the people managing the official account reported me for pointing out their mistake? Or am I being paranoid?) Has anyone else experienced this problem? It's a bit sad suddenly being unable to comment on the episodes on Youtube (or any video at all). Anyway, sorry for the OT post - I just wanted to vent my frustration, and perhaps give a word of warning to those interacting with these videos on YT. Only goes to show this right here is a far superior site to discuss classic B&B!

Probably, yeah! What really strikes me is how at first when I saw the episode, I thought the acting was unconvincing. It wasn't until a while in that I realized it wasn't the acting that was worse than usual, it was the emotional cues provided by the music that were missing! And it hit me that the background music that we take for granted actually can make the acting seem more convincing (or less, if it's the wrong music). I think this could be an important lesson for the current writers/directors/producers, because often when I watch current episodes the backgrund music actually takes away from the mood the characters are trying to portray. I thought about it a lot at the time of Kimberlin Brown's latest return, when she was playing Sheila subtly while there were anvils dropping all over the background score. (It sometimes reached the point where the ominous background music drowned out the dialogue of Sheila's scenes - and they weren't even very dramatic scenes.)

I have the German version of 956 and it has background music, so it's definitely an issue with the RTL Lounge broadcast, not the original US episode. I can understand versions without dialogue being used for dubbing, but a version with the dialogue left in but the music gone just seems so random (and useful only to aspiring film music composers who would like to make their own background scores for practice).

I just watched episode 956 and I realized the background music is gone. It's the weirdest thing. Is it the same for everyone? The voices are all there, it's just the music that's missing. It took me a while to figure out why the whole episode seemed a bit off, then it hit me.

Thank you so much! I've been wanting to see some of these for a long time! Does anyone have the missing July 2000 episodes 2000-07-11 and 2000-07-12?

Yeah, at work and in the family she is usually the voice of reason and stability. In her own personal life - not so much. Her inability to cope with personal problems (related to men) was always her Achilles heel.

So, I'm watching early 1991 right now (ep 955) and I still can't quite figure out what to make of Taylor's character. What was your impression of her in those days? This is where she is giving Storm's engagement ring a "trial run", while dating and making out with Ridge. Who would do that and why? (On a side note, this episode has a brilliant scene where Taylor goes to Stephanie at Ridge's request to have a therapeutic conversation with Stephanie about the divorce from Eric, and Stephanie easily turns the tables on Taylor and changes the subject to Taylor's divorce.) I'm not there yet but it's an interesting observation. I have been wondering when we'd start noticing the Brad Bell shift. Thorne definitely channeled his inner Ridge in that storyline (the premise of which was pretty contrived and sort of sexist if I recall correctly). I don't think it was necessarily in character for him to enjoy that living arrangement - I would have thought he'd be more respectful of women than his brother was. As for Macy, I think she always had it in her to degrade herself for a man. Her very first storyline on the show was all about this - she fell head over heels for Mick Savage, knowing he was on the rebound from someone and wasn't over that other woman. Sally warned her that Mick was only using her, but she wouldn't hear it and even threatened to cut Sally out of her life for being against her and Mick. Then she begged Mick to take her with her to New York, only for him to dump her for Kristen who had been his first choice all along. Macy *always* loses her sense of self preservation when she falls in love.

I'm not sure that is true outside the US. In my country, Y&R was never really a thing so when Sheila came om B&B she was just an unknown character and by then the show already had its loyal viewers. I agree with @divinemotion that the setting was a major part of the attraction. The glamour (in my country the show was even called Glamour), the fashion...

I think Stephanie was the show's center of gravity, so to speak. Everything and everyone existed in relation to her and had to take her influence into account. From Stephanie, two main "force fields" emanated - Stephanie/Brooke and Stephanie/Sally. That is why I'd say Brooke and Sally were the second most structurally important characters on the show after Stephanie. After these three characters, the rest is a matter of personal preference IMO. I may have tuned in to watch certain characters, someone else tuned in for some other characters. But there wouldn't have been a show without Stephanie. And it would have been a very different show without Brooke or Sally.

Yes, I really think Sally/Clarke was a stroke of genius! They were both character types that just don't exist on the show these days. And their union, absurd though it may seem, still made perfect sense for them. Sally's desire to win respectability by making Spectra a legitimate fashion house and getting herself a handsome young husband in the process, and Clarke's desire to succeed in his career even though it meant marrying Sally whom he was not at all attracted to. And in business, they were quite a team, but outside the office, their incompatible expectations eventually caught up with them. Clarke was really quite a fascinating character because his main focus was always his own ambition rather than any romantic interest. And because he valued his own ego above all, he always carried within him the seed to his own destruction. Time and time again, he got himself into trouble and it was always his own fault. He was the archetype of a man whose arrogance becomes his downfall. And it was clear that in the *very* early days of Sally Spectra, Sally was supposed to be more of a mob boss type of character. But I think Bill Bell was really quick with the "course correction" when he saw the true potential of the character. I think I can pinpoint the exact moment where Sally's heart and humor were born - it was a tiny nonverbal gesture during an interaction between Sally and Saul. They are talking about work and Sally is having lunch at her desk. And without stopping the conversation, Sally casually offers Saul her sandwich (or whatever it was) and he casually declines. Neither of them mention the tiny interaction, it's just a natural thing that happens while they keep talking about other things, but it speaks volumes about their relationship - they are a lot friendlier and more equal in status than we've been led to believe so far. (Imagine Eric Forrester offering food from his plate to one of his tailors - unthinkable!) Going back to watch the early Spectra scenes they are full of moments of nonverbal comedic brilliance. The dialogue just keeps going as if nothing at all is happening, and meanwhile they are making secret hand gestures, wiping lipstick off each other's faces, trying to carry too many office props at once, you name it.

Oh yeah, LOL, Nick and Jackie as mother and son! That was absolutely ridiculous. Jackie must have had Nick when she was in kindergarten. And the blonde curly-haired Phoebe was not at all believable as Ridge and Taylor's daughter. Other than that, I think there have been a lot of good matches on B&B. Taylor and Steffy (HT and JMW) I think looked like they could be mother and daughter. The eyes, the hair, the facial features. JY's Rick and AB's Bridget looked believable in the late 90s as Brooke and Eric's children (although they were more like Brooke than Eric). CD's Felicia and RM's Ridge looked like brother and sister. The hair and the cheek bones. Original Donna and Katie could definitely pass for sisters. Sally and Macy were also believable as mother/daughter - about the same height, low-pitched voices, and something about the facial structure, especially about the nose and eyes (I remember this one scene where Macy's face morphed into Sally's face and they were virtually identical). MC's CJ looked like a believable blend between Sally and Clarke. Sheila and teenage Mary Warwick (CD) were also very believable as mother and daughter.

Indeed! The first time around, I started watching from about early 1988, which caused me to root for Brooke over Caroline because I missed the beginning of that storyline. Watching from the beginning it's clear to me that Brooke was the rebound and Caroline was the unavailable one that Ridge really wanted. But it's equally clear watching the late 1990/early 1991 episodes that there Brooke's role is reversed - there it's Brooke who is the one Ridge prefers, although she is unavailable, and Taylor is the rebound. That being said, I don't necessarily think Ridge kept preferring Brooke over Taylor as he grew closer to Taylor. I just personally don't think Taylor had a lot of chemistry with anybody (with the possible exception of Storm).

I am watching early 1991 right now and to me it is obvious that Ridge is attracted to Taylor but more emotionally involved with Brooke, although he has given up on her because she's marrying his dad (kind of like he tried to give up Caroline after she married Thorne and dated Brooke instead). Another thing that is obvious is how Brooke is clearly more in love with Ridge than with Eric, and that that marriage was doomed before it began (Brooke dreaming about marrying Ridge on her wedding day to Eric). I agree that after Thorne, Grant was Macy's best pairing. He was very good with her and cared very deeply about her happiness. I think Macy as a character was very sensitive to OOC writing and it showed in the storylines the months before both her deaths. Because she was usually so decent and sweet, she didn't have a lot of leeway, so anytime she broke that pattern it made you go "whoa..." and it didn't always ring true. Usually it was her interactions with Brooke that pulled her out of character because Macy was shown to truly hate Brooke and it wasn't really in her nature to be hateful, bitter or vindictive (she usually ended up on friendly or at least civil terms with all her rivals - even becoming best friends with Karen). Also, she was more aggressive with Brooke than I'd say was believable for Macy (it was more in character for Macy to turn that destructiveness inward). But it went both ways - Brooke also showed her absolute worst side in her interactions with Macy to the point where it was almost OOC (I never really knew Brooke to be quite as gleefully sadistic with anyone else as she was with Macy - like when she sent her a drink, or when she casually suggested that Macy's mother was dead just to see Macy's reaction).

I'd say RM's Ridge had better chemistry with Brooke than Taylor. But to be honest, I haven't really liked any of Taylor's pairings. I find it really hard to connect with that character emotionally. As for who was Ridge's true love, I'd say Caroline hands down.