P.J.

Eeeeeeh...yeah, I don't see it either. The only reason I was ok with Hal/Em was that Em was pretty much OOC for their time together. I normally found KMH brittle and neurotic, and nearly completely unsympathetic. Boy, Caso must not have been around for her Em, because her Em slept with anything that wasn't nailed down.

I'm not sure how big an age difference there was supposed to be between Nick and Steve. IIRC, part of the reason Nick was killed off was negative viewer reaction to his romance with Kim.

Nick and Steve had always been at odds. Nick had blamed Steve for his wife and daughter's deaths in a fire (the wife turned up alive later). Steve had had an affair with her. He had stolen a necklace so they could run away before she was presumed dead. Then Steve quickly got involved with Carol, but ended up in jail for smuggling drugs for James. After Steve got out, Nick refused to stake Steve in a trucking business. Steve and Betsy ended up growing close and she offered him her trust fund. Nick thought Steve was using Betsy. They couldn't stay away from each other, Nick followed them to a secret picnic. Nick confronted Steve, they had a terrible fight, and Nick had a heart attack. Nick then extracted the promise from Betsy to stay away from Steve before he died. Which is why Betsy got involved with Craig. *This seems like a lot of story for the two years that Nick was on screen. He had saved Melinda from a fire before she wound up dying in the lake. And between Carol and Betsy, Steve had an affair with Maggie. Which is weird, because I thought she was involved with Frank.

Nick (Kim's husband) and Steve were half-brothers. Frank was their cousin. Steve's father was Michael Christopher, who had been convicted of being a Russian spy (or something.) It's unclear from my brief persual of the book when Steve became aware that he had a different father, before or after Nick's death. I'm not really sure---but Bob was having feelings for Kim around the time she got involved with Nick Andropolous. He died in '82. I have this vague recollection of Kim and Bob being a couple that was always teased between other romances. (Sort of like Carly/Jack but a lot less dysfunctional...lol)

I hadn't really thought about it in those terms, because it wasn't that her family didn't believe Iva. Seth, Caleb and Holden were never really comfortable with Josh hanging around (from what I recall). I do think part of the reason Iva always compromised was her lingering problems with self-esteem. It was like part of her was frozen at thirteen, and stuck at looking to Emma for approval. Not only did the relationship with John cause problems, but her keeping the Aaron secret. It was the only secret she kept in the decade she was on the show, and you'd have thought she'd murdered someone from Emma and Lily's reactions. No, I'm sure Marland wasn't thinking in terms of Iva still enduring the abuse. He was very into characters getting therapy and being "whole" again. Hopefully, had he continued with the show, he could have given Iva a better sense of self than she ended up getting. BTW, it's around the second anniversary of Lisa Brown's passing.

Poor Iva, constantly being stuck making those around her comfortable with their lack of concern for her feelings. I'd forgotten she was Ellie's maid of honor. UGH. Is it just ATWT that had this obsession with exes proving there are no hurt feelings with weird proofs of "acceptance"? Attending weddings/naming of godparents/etc? It's twisted that Iva was forced to be in both her sister's weddings. And I keep thinking of Carly having to sit through Jack's wedding to Janet with this plastic smile on her face while Jack seemed to be more focused on her than his bride.

See also: Shawn Christian.

You won't get any argument from me re: Block. I hated him on GL before I hated him on ATWT. I wouldn't be surprised if GL kept him on a little longer than they wanted. The fall of 99 was supposed to find a "Richard Branson" type character coming to town to get involved with Carly. It was in the previews, but then got derailed by Maura's pregnancy.

Sheffer's obsession with Hunt Block was weird. Yes, arguably, ATWT needed a rich [!@#$%^&*]-stirrer to drive story. (Alec Wallace was an epic failure..) But Block didn't have the charisma to do the role justice. Block should've been fired about year three. After many years of contemplation, I've decided that Craig's obsession wasn't really Carly. It was any one who had the talent to make him a buck. After Rosanna, when he's inexplicably involved with Jen's design business, he spouts the same tired lines to her that he said to Carly. And then Meg (even though that's SB.) ATWT got really lazy and couldn't develop story for Craig out of Carly's circle.

Found it----it's 2/12/01.

I can't be sure, but Colleen's might have aired 11/10/2000. Recaps of the episode say she and Hal had a fight over Craig. I'm pretty sure the scenes would've aired after the Halloween party that Craig threw that year. Barbara had asked for Craig's help getting an envelope addressed to Jack away from the courier (it held a picture of Julia and Winston Lowe) for Julia. But the episode isn't quickly found on youtube.

I wish her nothing but the best, but we all know she deserves more than she'll get.

Marie seems to have lasted a year or less, the book only lists her for 1985. Tad is listed as 1986. (I had forgotten there were two Tads.) I couldn't tell you for certain if Doug and Iva ever had a scene, but since Caroline's opened, I would guess they might've had a few lines. Marland wasn't a big "wink wink" , Easter Egg kind of guy from what I remember. I'm not sure you can blame PR for that. Marland wanted suspicion to fall on everyone other than Doug.

LOL...my memory's not that good..but wasn't Babs trying to hold on to Brian at that point? It might explain some dramatic rape whistle scenario. I did read in the ATWT book that Marie's baby was Tad Channing's, and that Iva was questioned, and she admitted she had also been having an affair with Tad. Also, Lisa suspected John was trying to cause trouble between Bob and Kim. Lisa was admitting to Babs she still loved Bob and that Ellen noted that the "gifts" always seemed to show up while Lisa was around. I couldn't find a specific reference to the card, but I know it tied into the lyrics of Someone to Watch Over Me, as it was a picture of a lamb and shepherd.

I wouldn't doubt Lisa suspected John, but I think the Christmas card Kim received was the same one Lisa was sending out that year.

I can't speak to whether Iva was a red herring in Marie's murder, but I distinctly recall we were led to believe it was Shannon calling Lucinda re: Lily.

In a strange coincidence, I also happened upon a Susan/Kim fight (which must have been early in Marie Masters' return) where Susan brings up Kim's acquiring daughters through marriage (Betsy and then Frannie) and then winding up with Bob's illegitimate child back in her life. I guess I had kind of forgotten how protective Kim could be of her kids.

Thanks for posting! I doubt I ever saw that, given I was probably in school. I had read about Iva not getting a warm reception from Emma, but YIKES. My guess would be Iva lost her spunk to be a direct contrast to Lucinda and thus Lily's "best mom/friend". Oh, I got lost down a youtube rabbit hole, and saw Kim give Seth true smoke for falling for Betsy. DAMN. Seth Snyder, the most empathetic, zero attitude guy ever in Oakdale, got a "kiddo" speech from Kim, who slept with her sister's husband. I am flabbergasted.

ATWT was clearly trying to recreate Lily/Holden and ride Shawn Christian's popularity. Of course, the best thing to come from the Ro/Mike relationship was Carly. LOL.

But IIRC, Don was gone shortly thereafter. It doesn't feel like his character was ever well-defined. Certainly not the same kind of impact Mike Bauer had on GL. If there was ever any kind of rivalry between Bob and Don, it certainly got overshadowed by Bob and John's animosity.

What? Bert was certainly no slouch in the vinegary-interfering mother department. If Nancy was seen as a bit colder, maybe it was because she didn't have the obstacles (broken marriage, health problems) that Bert did. I think the structure of Guiding Light at the time allowed the Dobsons to keep the Bauers "front and center". (Although there were probably viewers who saw the Spauldings and Marlers as interlopers) Mike and Ed were diametric opposites, each who generated story. When the Dobsons took over ATWT, they didn't have that with the Hughes, who at that time consisted of Bob, Tom and teenage Frannie.

And scenes like those were why I could never buy the regression of Craig in the '00s.

I believe Cricket's cousin's name was Skip, but that's neither here nor there. Frannie had led the teen set before Lily came to town. I would guess maybe Lily was brought on to give Dusty someone his age to interact with? I'm wracking my brain to try and remember...but other than Paul and Andy, who were younger, what kids were on canvas.

Lily was supposed to be some kind of moral center of the show (or one in training). She was especially Lucinda's judge, which in retrospect is kind of silly. She some how managed to be every man's ideal, so much so it was refreshing when Duke treated her like the brat she was. The break from Martha was good for the show, much like the break GL got from Kim Zimmer in the early '90s. Although they tried recreating the Lily/Holden dynamic with both Rosanna/Hutch and Ro/Mike.

I agree, it was stronger writing, and I'd actually argue the writing shone more because it wasn't Byrne in the role. I think DM had a huge blind spot where MB was concerned, and stories usually tilted to "fix" things to make Lily's life easier. I mean, the Snyders had to "accept" Josh so Lily could get to know her father. Rattray at least tried to be more mature in the role. Byrne would inevitably end up stomping and yell-crying through emotional scenes.