Xanthe

I was watching an episode from 1981 where Pat and Olivia are talking about a fundraiser and one of them suggests approaching a station with the call letters WCCB for help with a telethon. A few years later Mac's TV station was KBAY. Even with the Michigan/Illinois confusion I don't think anyone has ever intended to depict Bay City as west of the Mississippi. It never occurred to me before but KBAY is a bit of an anomaly. 

On 5/7/2020 at 1:03 PM, j swift said:

 

I'm not so sure about this because my addled memory was that Alice's return coincided with David's death and Sally initially hid the fact that she was Kevin's mother because she feared Alice's reaction.  Of course, the whole story was a retrofit that never gibbed with the history of Sally that we watched on screen.     

I went to YouTube to see if I could find any evidence one way or another. I haven't spent enough time on the reveal that Donna was digging up the dirt on Sally, but I did find both May 4 & 7 1984 and they show Alice's return and David's murder. At this point Alice already knows Sally is Kevin's mother and she is eager to meet him and completely nonjudgemental when Sally talks about having given him up and kept his birth a secret.

Mary Page Keller's Sally was certainly a far cry from the Sally who pursued Joey Perrini or committed crimes with Phil Higley or wondered why Steve cared about his stepdaughter Diana's reputation more than hers. However I find myself willing to forgive the change because the balance of the relationships between the characters and cast involved worked so well: Sally, Peter, Donna, Cecile, Cass, Felicia... Moving Sally into the more virtuous column left more room for Cecile.

11 hours ago, j swift said:

Then, when Alice finally returned to town in the mid 80's, she slut shamed Sally for having a child with David, while totally ignoring that she missed Sally's weddings to Peter, Caitlin, and Denny.  Later when Sally died, Alice never sought custody of her grandson and allowed Kevin to be raised by his ex-stepfather (who barely knew him) and his convicted murderer wife.

Did Alice "slut shame" Sally? I don't recall her being around between the reveal that Sally was Kevin's mother and David Thatcher's murder, and she seemed to be nothing but supportive of Sally throughout.

After Sally's death, Aunt Liz took Kevin out of town, leaving Catlin at a loose end to protect loathsome Brittany. When they left town there was no indication that the Ewings also took Kevin. I have always assumed that Liz and Alice raised him.

6 hours ago, KMan101 said:

 

It's live on YouTube. The Locher Room on YouTube. This is the link to it: 

 

It's definitely live, lol

Thanks (and to @Forever8 as well). My work schedule would make it difficult to watch at 2pm so I just needed to make sure I wasn't going to have to lie to get out of a Skype call to be able to watch it.

On 4/27/2020 at 10:10 AM, KMan101 said:

Alan Locher has finally scheduled an ANOTHER WORLD reunion! Linda Dano, Stephen Schnetzer, Amy Carlson and Joe Barbara are participating. 

 

I'm happy about the first three.

 

Thursday, April 30th @ 2pm 

 

https://www.soapoperadigest.com/content/another-world-online-reunion/

Will the reunion only be shown live or can it be watched later? 

6 hours ago, John said:

Regarding The Maggie recasts in 1995:

 

I know Robyn Griggs was photographed with John Wayne Bobbit so AW fired her

 

Jodi Lyn O'Keefe was only 16/17 at the time so maybe age got her fired. She began Nash Bridges soon After

 

Lisa Brenner was there a year & was written off due to story right?

My understanding was that Robyn Griggs was generally difficult and it wasn't just one innocent interaction with Bobbitt that got her fired. She was there for nearly 2 years. I liked her in the role though.

Jodi Lyn O'Keefe was on until November 1995. The first episode of Nash Bridges aired March 29, 1996. It seems more likely that O'Keefe quit AW to work on Nash Bridges than she was fired from AW and subsequently hired immediately on Nash Bridges which would have needed some time to film, edit etc. before airing.

53 minutes ago, DRW50 said:

 

Marley and Dennis.

Thanks! Wow, that never even crossed my mind as an option. I think seeing Brett made me think it must be someone relevant to her storyline. The only thing I remember about Marley and Dennis was that I found Chris Bruno dull and thought Marley should wind up with Byron. 

11 hours ago, DRW50 said:

 

 

 

Who are the couple in the coat closet in the first scene turning Brett away? It's so dark I can't make out their faces and I don't recognize their voices.

9 hours ago, Paul Raven said:

Did Iris come to Bay City due to Dennis having health problems and Russ being his doctor, thus leading to Russ/Iris romance?

Or have I got this mixed up.

Mac was first on the scene played by the first actor who was not the dashing catch portrayed by Douglass Watson.

Although the story is there was no intention to pair up Rachel and Mac, I wonder what the original plans were when Mac was recast with a more attractive actor?

Alice ran away from Bay City and got hired by Eliot Carrington as Dennis' private nurse under an assumed name. Iris was maddened by the idea that Alice and Eliot were romantically interested in each other and schemed and connived to keep them apart. Iris found out who Alice really was and that her brother was a doctor, and I guess there was also something that suggested he had expertise in Dennis' specific heart problem, so she made an appointment for Dennis with Russ.

Even before that for some reason Eliot took Dennis and Alice to St Croix when Steve and Rachel were also there. I had always associated St Croix with the Mitch/Janice storyline years later but for some reason it was already a place that featured in Another World even this early.

5 hours ago, amybrickwallace said:

 

Yes, they had an alliance because neither could stand Alice.

Based on what is in the Soaps & Serials novelization (book 4, "Love's Encore"), Iris thought poorly of Rachel and was only interested in how she could use her to influence Steve to take Alice away from Eliot Carrington [Iris' estranged/ ex-husband], and Rachel wanted to social-climb Iris. They didn't actually like each other and they didn't really have the same goals.

Iris on Rachel: "She's not the brightest creature you'll ever meet, but she is actually pretty in a common sort of way, and she's also extremely sexy." "Iris found Rachel an unbelievably ignorant social climber of the worst order."

Rachel on Iris: "Because Iris could introduce her to all kinds of people, all kinds of important people, she very much wanted Iris as a friend."

Iris offered to take Rachel to NYC for a shopping spree after Rachel and Steve's honeymoon in order to leave Steve at home alone on the theory that he would then be in contact with Alice. She had Louise eavesdropping on all kinds of conversations and when there is info about the possibility of Steve meeting up with Alice in Rachel's absence she maliciously wishes she could tell Rachel about it. In general it seems like Iris actively dislikes Rachel and Rachel is just incapable of liking anyone, she only thinks in terms of how they benefit her.

6 hours ago, DRW50 said:

 

I thought Rachel was, generally, competently written during Swajeski's tenure as HW, but the difference here, in Lemay's brief return, is tremendous. Rachel is so incredibly layered and even what could have been an everyday mother-daughter chat comes alive. 

Was the koi pond incident Rachel describes a real on-screen event? 

58 minutes ago, Khan said:

 

 

When you have a character like Vicky -- who could be a heroine, a bitch or both, depending on the circumstances -- you have to have someone like Bridget as a "talk-to" for her, in order for the audience to understand her motivations, as well to serve as a surrogate for the audience, giving her a shot of the truth when it's called for.  Otherwise, there's the danger of her coming across as too arch or unsympathetic.

 

Of course, once Jensen Buchanan's Vicky basically became all heroine, losing her edge from before, you no longer needed Bridget to explain her to the audience.  (Same for Ada, I guess, as Rachel evolved from villain to the show's central character).  Nevertheless, Bridget still served a purpose -- just as you've described, @Efulton -- as a constant presence in Vicky's life, and a reminder of how much she had evolved over the years.

Bridget was certainly always a supporting character, never really had any desires of her own. I don't know if it was ever clearly defined when Vicky's adoptive parents (Grace and Philip Carson) were supposed to have died. On the one hand it was supposed to explain why Vicky had been raised poor and was so close to Bridget, but on the other Vicky treated Bridget more like a servant than a parent. That suggests to me that Vicky must have been old enough to think of Bridget as an employee before she lost the Carsons.

Ada was a more fully-realized character and had her own storylines independent of Rachel from time to time.

8 hours ago, Paul Raven said:

My apologies for dissing  Ms JFP - I had my timelines mixed up. She did kill off Bridget but later teams put older characters on recurring and then wrote them off.

Mind you JFP did plenty of other stuff she could be criticized for -  AW- ER/BCPD Blue...

The link @DRW50 provided to the AWHP does talk about JFP's treatment of older characters:

JFP eliminated multigenerational stories by firing all the actors over 55: Bridget (a beloved 11-year vet), Clara (shamelessly carted off to the old folks home), Spencer (even though he was an integral part of the Justine, then the Ryan/Grant story) and Eddie (thus reducing Joe to the role of heavy in the Nick/Sofia story).

10 hours ago, Paul Raven said:

Somewhere along the line Douglass added that extra s to his name...

I believe he was born (Larkin Douglass Watson III) with the extra S but some of his early credits are without it for some reason, either his decision or the unwillingness of someone to believe in non-standard spellings. 

16 hours ago, watson71 said:

Then, the writers gave Cecile two poorly written story arc.  First, they tried to rewrite history and say that Cass, not Sandy, was Maggie's father.  Long time viewers who were watching the show in 1982-83 knew that Cass wasn't even in Bay City at the time and Cecile went back and forth on whether Sandy or Jamie was Maggie's dad.  Next, Cecile hired Rafael to "kidnap" Maggie so that she could get ransom money from the Corys to help her with her money troubles.  Again, another poorly written story.  In early Summer 1996, Cecile left Bay City never to be heard from again.  Frangione deserved better than this.  TPTB should have kept Cecile on the canvas.  She- not Lila- should have been the one to marry Cass in the AW finale.

I thought I remembered reading that Steve Schnetzer campaigned for the Maggie storyline at the time. And I can understand the argument that just because Cass wasn't on the canvas at the time [when Maggie was conceived] doesn't rule out the possibility that Cecile could have met Cass and had a fling with him offscreen within that timeline. There would have to be an explanation for why she never tried to use Maggie as leverage earlier in their relationship though. 

As for Cass marrying Cecile in the finale ... Cass matured so much from his beginning through his first marriage to Kathleen and then later with Frankie and Charlie that in order for that to be satisfying, the character of Cecile would have had to grow a lot as well. Otherwise she and Cass would have been too far apart. How would it have been possible to rehabilitate the character so that the audience could imagine Cecile and Cass living happily ever after?

5 hours ago, AbcNbc247 said:

Wow. This is an amazing article.

 

Thanks for posting @Efulton

 

It’s really a shame what happened to AW in the late 70s and early 80s. The show never really recovered after General Hospital got so popular. There’s so much we don’t know about what went on behind the scenes during Corinne Jacker’s tenure and this sheds so much light on it. It sounds like Beverly Penberthy was hinting that the only reason CJ brought in so many new characters was to make money, rather than try to save the show.  

I remember the info that HWs had this incentive to create new characters coming up in the mid-80s. It seems rather perverse since on the one hand viewers seem to crave familiar characters but also it is so easy for a show to completely change almost everything about a character -- usually with a recast -- other than the name. I'd be curious to know whether this really means for example that when Maggie Cory was played by Robyn Griggs, Jodi O'Keefe, and then Lisa Brenner in the early-mid 90s, did Corinne Jacker receive a residual just because she was the head writer when Maggie was born?

10 hours ago, Melroser said:

Great to see AW have a couple of 6's. I wonder what was going on the week of 7/11/86 to cause a 6.3? Isn't '86 when Tom Eplin, Ellen Wheeler, Stephen Schnetzer, Julie Osburn, Anna Stuart, and Sharon Gabet all left. I remember being devastated at the time. I loved Cass and Kathleen! 

Tom Eplin and Ellen Wheeler left in September. Their storyline spun its wheels for a little while first though with Marley out of town and their engagement in doubt.

Anna Stuart left in November and Donna was off the canvas until February. Donna and Michael did get married before she was hospitalized.

Stephen Schnetzer and Julie Osburn left in December (at the same time as Duke Stroud when Vince had to go on the lam), after Kathleen had had some time with her returned-from-the-dead mother Mary.

Sharon Gabet left the following January with Thomas Ian Griffith. Brittany's storyline was about trying to figure out how to escape from her abusive marriage with Peter with her baby, and then of course she shot him, was found guilty, and left the state intending to appeal the verdict.

Basically all of their storylines had the underlying theme of Reginald Love's villainy. I'm not sure that any storylines at the time managed to avoid it -- even the return of Mitch touched on it since Mitch was secretly working for Reginald and Reginald had killed Felicia's husband Zane, making her available to spend time with Mitch while writing a series of exposes on Reginald Love. I guess Nancy dating Greg had nothing to do with Reginald, so that's something.

16 hours ago, ScottyBman said:

So I am chugging away through 1981.  Mac just got custody of Amanda.  (Who is played by the cutest little girl...she is just a sweetheart on the screen).  

Dana Klaboe played Amanda until 1986 before she was aged to blonde Sandra Ferguson. I liked her a lot as Amanda and Mac's daughter. It seems likely that they chose the dark colouring to emphasize that she was Rachel's, especially if Mac was engaged to Alice. The hair colour was one superficial reason why I was disappointed in the first adult Amanda. When they cast Christine Tucci she felt more like the grown up version of the dark-haired little girl.

7 hours ago, jam6242 said:

Found this from March 1972.

 

Thanks! 

13 hours ago, jam6242 said:

From 1972, The Record (Hackensack, NJ)

Tony is furious with the handful of soap performers who appeared a while back on The David Frost Show. "They're bitchers and moaners who give daytime drama a bad name. They're out to break the magic."

 

 

Interesting article with some fascinatingly dated language. Thanks.

Does anyone know who the performers were who went on David Frost and what they bitched and moaned about?

Speaking of changes in history, the Another World Homepage gives Stacey Winthrop and Mark Singleton's daughter's name as Megan, and I know that is the name they used when Hilary Edson played Stacey and Mark and her daughter were said to have died in a car accident. However in the Christmas Day episode from 1984 when Felicia comes to celebrate Christmas with Cass he clearly comments that one of the presents looks like Marie wrapped it herself. Did Cass misspeak in 1984 or was the Hilary Edson era changing history?

7 hours ago, robbwolff said:

I recall AW establishing that Bay City was in Michigan in the early 80s. There was a shot of a map showing Bay City’s location and it was clearly Michigan. It was switched to Illinois around 1987. At that time, there was a scene where there was talk about seeing Chicago on the other side of the Bay.

1987 was a time when Margaret DePriest ignored huge swaths of history for sure.

I was looking at the Soaps & Serials books from the 1980s as well as the Kate Lowe Kerrigan novelizations from the 1970s to see if those could shed some light. Rachel has some thoughts about the population of Bay City being 50,000 people which is consistent with the real Bay City in Michigan. And she and Russ discuss eloping to Illinois, which suggests it's not the state they're in. Missy was on trial in Chicago, and Aunt Liz flies there (rather than drives) to talk her out of marrying Bill.

Some random googling led me to this Dark Shadows blog with some snarky remarks about Another World and Somerset. Apparently Julian Cannell was very handsome?

"Another World takes place in Bay City, which everyone refers to as fictional even though it’s sitting right there in Michigan, and there’s no use pretending that it isn’t."

I don't know whether they ever specified that our Bay City was in Illinois, but they certainly talked about Chicago a lot and rarely if ever Detroit. 

18 minutes ago, Paul Raven said:

I think that's right. Really Dennis should have been a priority character, not an afterthought.

He was in the right age group, related and linked to the Cory's etc.

I'm not surprised they waited until after they had Iris back on the canvas to bring Dennis back though. They could have created any old part for Chris Bruno if they wanted him. Adding Dennis without Iris would have left everyone wanting Iris.

Beverlee McKinsey was such a powerhouse I never really got used to Carmen Duncan as Iris and thought of her as a different person. If they had recast Iris sooner though we might never have had Donna Love, which would have been sad. 

33 minutes ago, Forever8 said:

 

Agnes had used her template over the years i.e. Headstrong vixens on the make and their single mothers who try to keep them grounded. 

I just need to sit and admire your phrasing for a moment. 

When I first saw photos of Robin Strasser's Rachel I was amazed by how much she reminded me of Erica Kane. 

This also reminds me of the SCTV soap parody "The Days of the Week" with blonde socialite Mrs McKay and her half-witted maid Mojo. I always thought they were Iris and Vivian but then I found out about Kay and Esther on Y&R.