53 minutes ago, AbcNbc247 said:

I remember reading somewhere that Todd Mckee and Jon Hensley both auditioned for Ben. But with both of them on other soaps by 1986, Idk who could've played a recast Ben

Yeah, based on the timing both of those sound like the original 1984 casting. The recast could have been anyone. But for some reason they decided to do without Ben (and Jake) after all, even after floating the idea in dialogue.

29 minutes ago, Neil Johnson said:

I asked a question about the first actor cast as Reginald, either here or on another platform a year or so ago.  Someone supplied the name of an actor, but I've forgotten the name.  He was a famous Broadway actor, and I believe was later criticized for playing an Asian character on Broadway, though he is Caucasian.   Maybe that will ring a bell with someone.  I would recognize the name, but it is not coming to mind right now.   

 

Jonathan Pryce?

I don't know if these are the hands of the original actor or a stand-in. The voiceover doesn't sound English (or like John Considine) and indeed sounds like it was dubbed in post. But this is the earliest Reginald/Vulture scene I can find.

16 minutes ago, j swift said:

Wasn't that spot taken up by Scott?

It could be understood that Cheryl and Scott were supposed to be a gender swapped Jake and Marley (despite the fact that Cheryl was a bit of snoozefest)

Also, Ben lacked charisma or many romantic hero qualities.

Ben's charisma could have been solved by casting. I wasn't clamouring for the return of Richard Steen. 

Scott was already right there when Cheryl was telling Mary that Ben was coming home. So if they intended to bring Ben back at that point it would have been in addition to Scott. I was hoping that the crack detectives who caught Tom becoming Mark and Mavis becoming Lorna might know what was going on with casting at the time. Of course 1986 is not 1991 and I don't think anyone has ever figured out who quit as Reginald before John Considine was brought in either.

Were there any other new young men around that time?

1 hour ago, Tonksadora said:

I always wished they'd brought Ben back. Someone told me at one point years ago that they decided to have either Ben or Jake but not both. Then, once they decided they liked Marley with Jake, then the jig was up for Ben. I have NO idea if that is an urban legend or not.

It depends on when they were making the decision. Jake originally arrived in Bay City February 4 1985 and Ben last appeared only a couple of weeks later on Feb 21. Certainly it appears that Richard Steen did not last out his contract as he had been around for less than a year. But Jake and Marley left town in Sept 1986, leaving a void in the middle of a story focused on the McKinnon family where it would have made a lot of sense for Ben to be present. Jake didn't return until May 1988. A Ben could easily have kept the McKinnon spot warm for him even if they had decided to swap the character out when Tom Eplin returned.

I always thought it strange that they didn't bring Ben back to Bay City, especially when Mary came back from the dead and while Jake and Marley were gone. I was surprised to find that Cheryl mentions him here -- not only to say that they had let Ben know that Mary was alive, but she even goes so far as to claim that he is coming home (and they don't really know what happened after he dropped out of school). But Ben never showed up. They must have at least tried to cast him but it's baffling to think what could have happened. They could have had Ben date Nancy instead of introducing outsider Tony Carlisle, and/or thrown Ben and Vicky together. The only reason I can think of that they would not have wanted a Ben character would be that he would not be a romantic option for Cheryl, but they didn't really offer Cheryl any alternative to Scott except perhaps creepy Chad Rollo.

30 minutes ago, Efulton said:

I think I’m the only AW fan you liked Rhonda Lewin as Vicky. But Anne Heche was by far one of the best performers to ever walk through those doors in Brooklyn!

A lot of the problems I had with Rhonda's Vicky at the time are the same issues I had with Anne's Vicky initially: the character seemed shallow and superficial and gullible. She trusted Reginald because he indulged her and had just a supporting role in the conflict between Michael and Reginald. Donna was fading out. Marley and Jake and Carter and Thomasina and even Dee I believe were gone. If they had intended to start something with Neal he was gone, and the rumour that they were introducing a brother for Jake didn't pan out. They didn't do much with Vicky and Nancy. They did throw Vicky together with Jamie a little bit but it wasn't until much later with Anne that things got interesting there. Maybe Rhonda could have been better with better writing but she didn't elevate it on her own. 

Did Rhonda's Vicky have real scenes with Bridget or did it get treated like Bridget was Reginald's servant and she hardly knew Vicky? 

On 9/21/2022 at 1:15 AM, Tonksadora said:

Sharon Rose Gabet got a huge kick out of it. Said it was clear from that it was self defense & the jury found her guilty! Carried on a bit. For anyone who doesn't know, that was a stunt they did where part of the audience was the jury.

The jury had to make do with testimony -- they couldn't "see" the scene on video. And we also got a little clip of Quinn hustling Rachel out because Brittany had called right before talking about how she was going to kill Peter! Quinn testified to that at the trial, too. And probably half of the rest of Bay City testified similarly because Brittany had been running around town buying weapons and brandishing knives and talking about how much she hated Peter and wanted him dead. I can't blame the jury.

25 minutes ago, j swift said:

This sent me on a whole rabbit hole of Zack

Trying to find out more about Zack sent me to some weird places and illuminated nothing. But one site offered me a photo of what it insists is Matt Ashford and Page Hannah when surely it must be Emma Samms. Isn't it?

https://m.famousfix.com/post/search-for-tomorrow-matthew-ashford-114000210?nx=22428

2 hours ago, robbwolff said:

Schmigadoon was awesome! And Ann’s song about her husband Mayor Manlove was brilliant. Starting tomorrow and for the next few weeks, my office is watching Schmigadoon during lunch.

 

I am very much looking forward to season 2: Schmicago.

The only other Schmigadoon/soap credit I am aware of is Jane Krakowski on Search For Tomorrow.

I was looking at the actor guide on the AWHP and happened to notice Ann Harada's name. I had not been very aware of her before Schmigadoon which I enjoyed a lot. Her imdb credits name the AW role as "Mimi" in 1991. Does anyone remember anything about Mimi? It may have been a very insignificant part, I just always have fun recognizing people who went on to bigger things.

15 hours ago, j swift said:

LORNA DEVON

GENERAL INFORMATION
First Appearance: April 25, 1991

Given that the information was published in the 4/16/91. Mark (renamed from Tom) was introduced on 4/10, and Lorna on 4/25, that is a brilliant guess!

Searched the forum, confirmed (I should have done this as a proper quote, these are @Forever8  's comments )   

Quote

Alicia Coppola (Lorna Devon -

She said originally the character's name was going to be Mavis Lane. She said she glad they changed it and that she still has her audition sides.

 

12 minutes ago, DRW50 said:

Good eye @j swift . I am trying to remember if the soaps here ever had a major  character named Mavis. Corrie, of course, had an iconic character with that name. 

What was the name that Alicia Coppola said turned into Lorna? I thought it was something weird and old fashioned.  Could it have been Mavis?

18 hours ago, DRW50 said:

Perusing the minor characters list briefly reminded me of confusing it was to see Bill Shanks pop up on AW months after a  high-profile exit on ATWT. I wonder if he was ever planned to have a larger role. 

 

On the one hand it appears the part of Mark was recast after only a few weeks. On the other Amanda whom he had been dating reconciled with Sam after a couple of months and that seemed to leave the character nowhere. Seems a lot like planned obsolescence since they didn't set up any other storyline for him.

I noticed the entries for Jake's parents Alice and Ray (as they were called to set up the Kevin half brother storyline).  It made me wonder who had played Jake's mother, then called Helen, who had lunch with Kathleen the day Marissa was flying back to Bay City in August 1986. Since she's not in the Minor Characters I suppose if she's anywhere she's just listed as a Day Player without a character name.

4 hours ago, Tonksadora said:

Wasn't that a strange moment?! I wondered if it was in the script or if Doug just got lost & they kept taping, anyway.

I am not an expert, but I am going to guess that it was in fact scripted because of how clean Neal's line and reaction shot were. If it wasn't scripted I would have expected some scrambling to catch the reaction (or only get the voice offscreen).

15 hours ago, Tonksadora said:

In Loving Memory of Robert Lupone

Sorry about the quality.

Wow. Tomb dust disease had a lot of symptoms when it didn't knock you out right away. Sometimes Mac seemed to be manic, with his enthusiasm for electronic books; he was a bit more paranoid when he fired Liz; and he also seemed to have some kind of dementia when he forgot when it was and called Neal Alfred (or Albert) and tried to call Ada's house to reach Rachel.

20 hours ago, Paul Raven said:

Neal was introduced at the tail end of the  previous regime and when Whitesell and DePriest arrived they dropped him for a more 'attractive' brother, probably as soon as his contract cycle allowed.

I'm sure Lupone was a fine actor but to be cast as a leading man twice (also Tom Bergman on SFT) seemed an odd choice.

Don't know why they made Adam a Cory also. The never before mentioned branch of the family seemed false.

Perhaps Adam could have been a returned Dennis Carrington/Wheeler.

Neal does come across in the episode here as more leading-man-like than I remembered, with a bit of an edge. The bit where he blurts out to the twin he thinks is Marley that he's in love with Victoria seemed very odd. I mean I understand from a story point of view that it piques Vicky's interest so she calls him, but it didn't seem internally motivated in any rational way, especially given that he appeared to sincerely believe he was talking to Marley.

I agree that Mac's brother and nephews always seemed to have come out of nowhere and didn't really feel fully integrated, especially the way Neal disappeared as soon as Adam arrived. Maybe they didn't think to bring Dennis back because they thought he would be too old for Victoria. Or they didn't want to stir up memories of Iris.

Just saw the post about Robert LuPone's death in the In Memoriam thread. He played Neal Cory on Another World for about 6 months. The character, although technically Mac's nephew, didn't really seem to fit anywhere -- it wasn't clear to me whether he was always intended as short term or if they decided he wasn't working out and replaced him with Adam. I had forgotten that although he seemed to be trying to steal the Egyptian treasure it had turned out that he was actually an undercover federal agent. His behaviour continued to seem sinister and he harassed Victoria and possibly almost raped her. Then he left immediately once Adam arrived and was never mentioned again.

14 minutes ago, Faulkner said:

Her New York Times obit.

Thanks for this. Quite a career. Even at her worst Victoria was never an "evil" twin and I wish the NYT had not reductively  described the twins as "good and evil". (And if you didn't know the characters based on the ordering of the names you might think that Marley was the evil one.)

2 hours ago, victoria foxton said:

 

Thanks for this. I find it hilarious how Liz just dumps Kevin out so she can talk confidentially with Catlin. I also was starting to roll my eyes at Sandy because it seemed like he was taking offense that Mac wanted to have Peter go over his deal. Peter's a lawyer! He has specific expertise that you don't have! It is normal to have lawyer review contracts as a matter of course! But the scene ended and we didn't come back to it.

The snippets are a bit out of order since we seem to start with David already dead and then see him alive then Catlin in jail for his murder again. David was murdered on May 4th. Nothing seems to be later than Catlin's trial or before the arrival of MJ so I would guess in the range of February to June. 

10 hours ago, ScottyBman said:

I would have been on board with that.  Perhaps even at some point Peter buying some interest in the Hudson Group as he would have I guess had some part of the Love fortune back from inheritance from Reg.  They could have even retcon a Brittany (recast as Sharon Gabet doubtfully would want to return) and claim Peter Jr's claim to the Love money.  I would have ventured far easier to buy than Cecille claiming that Maggie was really Cass's daughter and not a Cory.

Peter wasn't present at the reading of Reginald's will in 1988 but according to the AWHP synopses, Scott got a fair bit of money, Mary got property in Paraguay, and the rest went to Vicky. Donna and Nicole explicitly got nothing. No mention of Peter or Marley so I assume they also got nothing. Of course there was also a confusing plot at the time where Nicole had a condition on her trust fund that absolutely forced her to have to marry in order to access the money even though there had been no similar condition on Marley's trust fund in 1985. There are probably many ways however that they could explain Peter having massive wealth suddenly if they had wanted to.

Reverting "Little C" or Catlin Jr to Peter Reginald and ignoring the whole storyline where Brittany tricked Peter into believing he was her baby's father and they had the whole thing out on the stand during her trial for Peter's attempted murder seems much more challenging, and possibly not worth it just to bring Brittany back. I think it would be easier and possible more fruitful to instead reveal that Emily Benson had not died and she had secretly raised her and Peter's baby.

If absolutely essential to bring back Brittany, why not retcon that although Little C was Catlin's baby, actually Brittany had been pregnant with Peter's baby when she left town with Catlin and that baby had been raised to believe Catlin was its father. (I am starting to warm to the idea of Brittany's return, provided we find out that her appeal failed and she spent some time in prison.)

1 hour ago, DRW50 said:

Stephen and Julie Osburn wanted to leave. Stephen then agreed to return, presumably.

As I recall he went to California for pilot season but didn't get anything so returned to AW. 

2 hours ago, Marissa Gallant said:

Supposedly, he didn't even remember Megan. So, he wasn't ignoring Greg, he didn't know about him. 

 If you had asked me to name characters on Santa Barbara, I would never have come up with Megan and Greg. But as soon as the discussion started here I could vividly picture Paul Johansson (whom I clearly remember as the least interesting character in Soapdish) and Meg Bennett.

20 hours ago, Paul Raven said:

The original Matthews girls. Susan Trustman as Pat and Liza Chapman as Janet were frontburner for the first two or so years. Jacquie as Alice was supporting.

Janet wasn't the same generation as Pat and Alice, was she? 

8 hours ago, Jdee43 said:

 

I do think by the mid-to late 70s though, Victoria Wyndham was the unofficial star of the show, and pretty much the main character into the 1980s. The proof of the pudding are the cast lists at the end of the show. You can find them pretty regularly on youtube starting with 1979. Her name is always first, followed by Douglass Watson second, and then the rest of the cast, usually in the order in which they joined the show. Her name comes first all the way to the last episode. 

Interesting to compare on youtube a cast list at the end of a September 1974 episode to one at the end of an October 1979 episode. In the one from 74, Victoria Wyndham is 3rd from the top; Alice is #1 and Steve is #2; and Douglass Watson is third from the bottom. In the October 1979 episode, Victoria Wyndham is number 1; Douglass Watson number 2, and that's the way it stays until Watson's passing in 1989. 

By mid-1987 only Wyndham, Watson, Ford, and Dano had been with the show for more than a year or so.  And only Constance Ford had been there longer than Victoria Wyndham. I am not sure whether Wyndham and Watson had credits above Ford simply because they had leading roles and Ada was more supporting, or if it is possible that Ford was not on contract at some points during her tenure. Contract actors were always listed above day players. 

The only special credit I can think of from the mid-1980s onward is that Denise Alexander was put at the end of the credits as "and Denise Alexander as Mary McKinnon".

15 minutes ago, victoria foxton said:

Pretty sure the date is wrong. Sandy and FakeBlaine were long gone by May of 85. Plus, this clip seems to have an early Dee appearance. Who debut in Jan/85. Anyway. i don't think this clip has ever been online before.

 

I agree regarding the dates. If Peter is there to visit Emily and Dee has just arrived, it must be January. The AWHP has Dee's first day as January 22 1985 and Emily's last day as January 28. I think it's the 22nd.

30 minutes ago, j swift said:

I think I've made this point before, but there was never a time when the audience was able to see what attracted Mary to Reg.  He was so instantly threatening that it never made sense why Mary stayed with him for so long, but there must have been something that kept together for so many years.  In fact, I wonder of Mary was with Reginald longer than she was married to Vince?

I think we were supposed to believe that Reginald was capable of concealing his true self and appeared to Mary as charming and refined. He kept her comfortably in their hacienda in Paraguay and neither she nor Scott knew that he was an international criminal and homewrecker.

I think we have tried to puzzle out the timeline before and it's hazy. If Cheryl was a baby when Mary left then we have to assume it's been at least 15 years. I think Mary and Vince were supposed to have started their family young, but I don't think it was clear how much older Kathleen and MJ were supposed to be (and whichever of the two was supposed to be the eldest at a given point in time). You would have to have a 12-year gap between the oldest and the youngest (not impossible, 29 vs 17 in 1986) or the McKinnons not starting their family right away to match the 15 years with the Vulture.