xtr

Jamal breaks my heart every damn episode. He thinks his father hates him. Not even a little. I actually think he is his father's favorite. I liked how the writers gave us insight into why he is the way he is with Jamal. He is afraid. he's scared of what the world will do to him. It's "life or death in these streets".

I like the way that TH is portraying Lucious's feelings for Jamal. I definitely think that Lucious has love and affection for Jamal. Granted it's mixed with some disapproval but it's definitely not hate. I am looking forward to see what happens between Lucious and Jamal, especially now that Jamal is going to try and make it on his own.

I could see Jamal trying to avoid Lucious, for a while, (unless he wants to confront him about something) and if that happens, I think it will be interesting to watch. I think that if Jamal doesn't really want anything to do with Lucious, that is going to really bother Lucious. I could see him keeping tabs on Jamal, and still finding reasons to get in Jamal's face and try and talk with him.

Jamal/Lucious is one of my favorite relationships dynamics on this show along with Cookie/Lucious.

There are any number of reasons to hate Lucious, but I can't do it. I'm convinced that he loves Jamal, but just can't come to terms with him being gay, yet. IRL, it would be really hard to defend, but on the show they make his struggle so clear, it's hard for me not to feel for the man.

I've thought since the first episode that Lucious is still in love with Cookie, but I wonder if she still loves him. That's less clear to me.

I think that she might still love him, but that she gave up on them a long time ago, after she went to prison and they got divorced. I think that she has resigned herself to thinking that they are never going to get back together. I thought see seemed surprised when he told he loved her, but I think that she was happy about it. I really like how he expresses his thoughts to her, he is just so comfortable with her.

I don't hate Lucious either, in spite of his faults, I really like him and I Think that has a lot to do with TH's acting. He just adds a softer element to Lucious. Like when he was telling the agent how he wanted her to lock Cookie up, and then joking with Cookie about how he had a parole office he didn't like one time and then inviting Cookie to dinner. Or having issues with Jamal, but still joking in a soft way how his room is bigger than Jamal's room at the loft, and seeming happy at first that Jamal would perform for everyone.

I think that he loves Jamal as well, and really didn't want Jamal to leave the apartment because he didn't want Jamal on the streets. I also thought he seemed a bit impressed that Jamal stood up for himself and told him off.

Things seemed to be a moving at a fast pace on tonight's show.

Lucious openly admits he loves Cookie. (She seemed surprised by that). Jamal stood up to Lucious and might be going a little dark already, with his saying he'd take Lucious empire from him. I enjoyed the scenes between Cookie/Lucious and Jamal/Lucious.

We also were shown a man that's interested in Cookie, Puma. I enjoyed Cookie's and Puma's interaction. I wonder if/when we will see them again. I enjoyed seeing Cuba, along with Naomi, and Gladys, which was a nice surprise.

But I wouldn't be surprised if he goes off the rails and Cookie shows him the same compassion that she has always shown Jamal, thereby, strengthening the bond he has for his mother.

I could definitely see this happening.

Right now to me it seems like Andre is kind of being isolated from the other members of the family. Most of his interactions are with Rhonda. We really haven’t seem interact with his younger brothers at all, which I think is interesting. I want to find out what exactly his relationships with his brothers are like. Does he get along with one better than the other? Does he look down on both of them? I get the sense that he’s not really close to either one of them. I remember him brushing Jamal off at the dinner table, in the first episode.

It would help the character if he interacted with other people and had another character in his corner besides Rhonda. Jamal and Hakeem have one parent that favors them and they have each other. Andre doesn’t even have that. Heck he doesn’t even seem to have friends, which I think is sad. Jamal has friends, and Hakeem has a crew of friends, none for Andre so far.

I am interested in learning more about Andre and his backstory. Maybe we will get to see some flashbacks of him as a kid, giving us more insight about him.

I'm so over Hakeem. His behavior in the restaurant was just disgusting. I'm glad Cookie called him out to Lucious for the entitled little [!@#$%^&*] he is.

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I think Cookie is starting to have some disdain for Hakeem. She’s his mama but he’s acting terribly. I thought it was funny how Porscha mentioned it was messed up that Cookie didn’t seem to have a problem with Jamal upstaging Hakeem. I believe that Cookie loves Hakeem, but that there is only so much she can do with a child who doesn’t want anything to do with her. I can understand him having issues with her, but she didn’t abandon him willingly. He could try and give her a chance.

I wonder if in developing Anika/Cookie’s rivalry, the writers will have Hakeem develop a bond with Anika. Maybe Anika could become another confidant for him like Jamal is. That’s something I think would bother Cookie, much more than Anika parading around in her underclothes. I could see Cookie being very upset with her youngest son bonding with Anika and taking her side over Cookie’s. I hope that Hakeem and Cookie will eventually become close. But I wonder if until then, the writers might have Hakeem bond with Anika, to fuel her and Cookie’s rivalry.

I am not mad at Jamal one bit about not coming out because he needs his father's assistance to live. That is realistic and a battle that Jamal need to fight onscreen. Had he immediately decided to not give into his father's threats, we wouldn't see the stakes build or what went into Jamal's choice. We need to see the struggle. Plus, Jamal is human. What human being wouldn't consider how they would maintain their lifestyle. People put up with crap everyday at job's because they WANT to eat well, as opposed to just eating. Money matters!

Is CookieLu the ship name? I flove it!

I agree that Terrence Howard showed a lot of nuances and depth in his acting last night.

I was glad that the scene with him and Jamal in the car at least showed that Lucious has been looking out for him financially like he has for the other sons. As bad as he's treating Jamal, at least up until yesterday's episode he wasn't threatening to/hadn't cut him off financially. Also I was glad that Lucious seemed kind of proud of how Jamal and Hakeem performed together, and that their performance helped him see that both of his youngest sons are talented. Lucious/Jamal have a long ways to go in mending their relationship, and I'm looking forward to more interactions between them.

Also a couple of random thoughts about yesterday's episode. Did anyone else think that the young lady playing Hakeem's love interest looked like Malinda Williams off of the Soul Food TV series? I thought that she looked like she could be Malinda's younger sister, I think they are both pretty ladies.

Also, did anyone else notice how rude Lucious was to his housekeeper? First he told her in a rude way that he didn't want her around him in the room when he's exercising and then he told her to be quiet when she had said something at the dinner table. Cookie asked her if she talked, lol. I wonder if this Housekeeper has witnessed some of Lucious devious activities and has some dirt on him. Maybe he is paying her well to be quiet.

Anywho, I'm am so in love with this show. Terrence owned last night's show. The elevator scene was Golden Vault material. Loved it. Are CookieLu gonna hook up? Absolutely! The only thing we need to do is figure out when - the night before a wedding to Anika would be perfect and soapy! Stank ass Anika coming out in her undies because she's intimidated by Cookie? Heffa!

lol, I like that Cookies just seems to view Anika, as kind of a pest. I think that Anika is just kind of there for Cookie right now. I think that the way that she's really going to annoy Cookie is if she gets in the way of Cookie's plans for Empire/Jamal. I don't think that Cookie cares too much right now about Anika's relationship with Lucious. But Anika already seems threatened by Cookie and this is before she's aware of Lucious's feeling for her. Imagine how she will act when she realizes that he still has feelings for Cookie.

When I first saw the previews of this show and I didn't know anything about the premise of it, I thought that Taraji might have been a playing a bitter woman from his past, that Terrence's character has a lot of disdain for. I am happy that is not the case. Cookie is a woman that Lucious was building a life with, and that he loved (possibly still loves). I think that he still has feelings for her, and he seems to respect her on some level, including as a parent. The last scene they had on last night's episode was nice,I like the connection they have as parents/former spouses.

I thought they looked good together in the scene they shared before she threw the shoe at him. He gave her another one of those "looks". I want to see how their relationship develops throughout the show. I believe that if Cookie had never went to jail, they still would have been together as a couple.

I think the family still might have had some dysfunction in it, but I think they would all been better off if Cookie had never went to jail. Especially Hakeem. I think that if Cookie hadn't went to jail, her and Lucious would have grown together as a couple, raising their family and becoming successful in the music business. Lucious seems to have changed since he's become rich, and evolved to a degree, but I think that Cookie would have adjusted to that lifestyle and evolved right along with him, had she never went to jail.

I guess Anikka is threatened by Cookie. What woman comes out to show their assets in such a manner. I guess she and Luscious are not married considering the way that the kiddies referred to her as Hakeem's "dad's woman." I am waiting on that subject to come up. And are they really trying to sell her as younger and hotter than Cookie. LMBO! Please stop.

Kinda disappointed that the singer didn't make Hakeem work for it. She's a gorgeous girl, the by the way.

I think that she's threatened by Cookie too. I have a feeling she's going to be instigating many of her confrontations with Cookie. I think that Cookie will be checking/warning her at times, but I could see Anika saying and doing things to try and get underneath Cookie's skin. I loved that Cookie seems unaffected by Anika, even when she was walking around the house in her underwear. Cookie seemed more upset about seeing how far Lucious as come as an artist, like the sad expression she had when she saw the house, than she does about Anika.

I think that Cookie understands Lucious very well, better than Anika does. I am really enjoying the way they interact with each other. I think he definitely still cares for her. I liked how they interacted as parents at the end of the show. I thought he seemed proud when he told her that she was right that Jamal and Hakeem fit well together on the stage. I also liked how she chastized his parenting of Hakeem, and he said he didn't want to argue with her about that. They definitely seemed like parents/two people who were married to each other.

I'm looking forward to a "Cookie gets a new man" storyline, even though I think that may not happen this season. I could see that happening in another season. I think it will be fun to watch Lucious deal with her getting a new man. I think that will bother him worse than it bothers Cookie to see Anika parading around in her underwear.

Yes, it was interesting that Cookie and Rhonda seem to get along, unless Cookie was just using her.

Was it Vernon who defended Cookie, or Andre? I thought it was Vernon originally, but then Andre was looking at FoFo like he was one second away from beating him and Cookie gave him that look... Maybe it was both lol

I would have done the exact same thing: You're taking your meds whether you like it or not!

I think that Cookie may have thought that Rhonda was okay. I think she might make comments here and there about her to Andre or whoever, but I think that for now, they might get along alright. Especially if Rhonda continues to try and help her like she did on tonight's episode.

Also, I think that Vernon was the only one that really defended Cookie. He defended her twice, once in the office, and in the elevator I thought that Andre didn’t really do anything, he just kind of look like there was drama but I don’t think he said anything. I can’t say I’m really surprised that Lucious didn’t really defend her, but I thought that Andre could have stood up for his mama more. Jamal defended their mother to Hakeem, I think that Andre could have defended her to the rapper.

I'm surprised Anika hasn't had a child with Luscious as a means of holding on to money and power.

I think that she could end up getting pregnant later on. I could see a storyline where she ends up finding out she's pregnant after her and Lucious break up/he realizes he still loves Cookie. He could leave her for Cookie, only to find out that she's pregnant with his baby, and she uses that child to try and get a share of Empire.

At least she's not keeping his meds from him in some kind of power play.

It was nice seeing the brothers perform together.

So far, Rhonda isn’t one of my favorites on this show, but I think that she does love Andre. I think that her threatening to have him committed, is because she cares about him. Her and Cookie seemed to get along okay, heck she treated Cookie more respectfully in this episode than Hakeem has treated her so far.

I didn't quite care for this episode the way I did the pilot, but it was still good, and I'm in it to see where it goes over the rest of the season. Andre is bipolar, but how disappointing to see how seemingly controlled he is by his scheming wife. P-U-$-$-Y now comes to mind when describing Andre. She threatened to have him committed if he didn't stay firm on his medication. Really?

I was disappointed that he didn’t really have much of a reaction when the rapper was talking trash to his mother. He just kind of stood there while the man threatened and cursed at his mother. (Lucious acted trifling in that scenes as well), I think that Andre could have stood up for his mother. The only one that stood up for Cookie in that scene in the elevator was Vernon. I think he stood up for her, when she went into the office and was exchanging insults with the rapper as well.

I don't know what happened but Hakeem became hotter and hotter as the episode went on. He's one of those characters that constantly mess up but can't help but like.

I thought Hakeem looked better in this episode as well.

I thought that tonight was another great episode of Empire. Taraji continues to be great, I thought that she was in more of a schemer/plotting mode this episode. I thought that it was kind of amusing how her new assistant was talking about how it was wrong for her to try and upstage Hakeem with Jamal.

I also like how she wasn’t the least bit unnerved when “Halle Berry” was walking around in her underwear after she found out Cookie had arrived. I thought that was very catty of “Halle” lol.

I also like how Cookie seems to bring out another side of Lucious, who he was as a person before he made it big. That speech he gave with the talk show host, was due to Cookie’s comments on the news, that struck a nerve with him. I thought that their scene at the end of tonight’s episode was another example of him still having feelings for her. He gave her another one of those “looks”, like there is still something there between them.

I continue to enjoy Hakeem/Jamal’s relationship. I really like the way they talk to each other and their relationship as brothers. I love how they support each other. And we found out that Andre is Bipolar, I think it’s going to be interesting to see what they end up doing with storyline with him.

So, no one took my bait about Andre? I think he suffers from some sort of mental illness and always has even as a child.

I think this could end up being the case. I want to see how the storyline with him taking the pills plays out. Maybe he does have some type of mental disorder, and he's hiding it from family, especially Lucious, because he's afraid that Lucious will be ashamed of him and that this could cost him whatever chance he has of running the company. He knows that he's not Lucious's or Cookie's choice to run the company, and I could see that being one of the reasons why he's hiding his illness. He doesn't want to possibly diminish whatever chances he has of running the company.

We haven't seen flashbacks of Andre as a child yet, maybe we will see some flashbacks of him as a kid, that will give us some more insight as to what is going on with him.

Also, I was thinking along the lines of what DramatistDreamer had said about Cookie's reaction to Andre. I think that she did seem impressed, proud, but also maybe a bit embarrassed that her oldest son had done so well while she was away in prison. After he mentioned that he should have visited her, it seemed like she was implying that she didn't blame him for not visiting her, while he was trying to better himself. I thought that she seemed proud but also a bit embarrassed that she couldn't be there for her oldest son, while he was becoming successful.

xtr:

I thought it was interesting that Lucious didn't disown Jamal. He could have done that with Cookie out of the way so long, so I'm going to assume that on some level he still loves him, even if he can't accept him at this point. The fact that he's ill might be one thing that brings him around.

I thought that was interesting too. And I think he’s still looking out for Jamal financially, just like he’s looks out for Hakeem/Andre. Even though Hakeem definitely is the most spoiled one of the bunch. Jamal has mentioned that he’s not into touring, and hasn't really been working on an album or things like that, but he still seems to be living well. I believe that Lucious is making sure that Jamal has access to money and other things so that he can live a very comfortable lifestyle. Right now Andre is probably really the only son who is legitimately earning a big paycheck, even though I believe that Lucious still gives him things as well. I do like that in spite of whatever issues Lucious has with his kids, that they are still his kids, and that he’s still looking out for them in some ways.

Give it till season 2 lmao. You know the season 1 finale will involve a betrayal.

Somehow I see Jamal (who I think of as the "innocent" one) being the one who turns dark at a certain point. It would make a lot of sense given the family dynamics at play here.

I think the reason why the show is so excellent is the family relationships to be honest. Despite the tension you can feel/see the love. You can tell that the enmity between Cookie and Uncle Vernon runs deep...why I have no idea but it's so fascinating. At the same time this guy Lucius divorces the one woman who helped him start this "empire" and yet it's clear that he's still fascinated by her spirit and may even be in love with her.

I could see a situation where Andre orchestrates something to make it look like either Hakeem or Jamal betrayed the other one. They seem really close and I don't know if just competiting musically/being the favorite of each parent will be enough to damage their relationship.

Also, later on I could see Jamal doing something that seems very uncharacteristic of him. Maybe he'll end up doing one bad thing that's big, or he'll mess somebody over in some way. They may not turn him very dark, but I could see them having him do something really wrong, and/or mess somebody over in some way.

I agree with you about seeing the love in the family. Lucious does seem to still love Cookie and I believe he loves all of his sons, including Jamal. The way he treats Jamal is wrong, but I am glad that it hasn't gotten to the point to where he's completely disowning him/doesn't want to even see him/talk to him. He still invites him over to the house, and talks to him (somewhat), I'm glad that their relationship isn't completely unsalvageable.

I want it to get to the point during this first season, that he will at least acknowledge/appreciate Jamal's talent. I hope that him lying to himself and others about Jamal's talent doesn't last long. I think that he will continue to not accept Jamal being gay, for a while, but maybe he will admit soon that his son is a talented musician. I think that it will be interesting to see him admit that his Jamal is very talented, even like him in some ways, and how that and other factors might cause him to struggle with his decision over who should run the company. I could see Cookie highlighting Jamal's talents enough to where it won't be as clear cut in Lucious mind, as to who should run the company,

I don't think that right now Andre has much of a chance of getting the company, but I think he's going to be do a lot of very manipulative things to try and get Empire. I am also interested in seeing how Andre/Cookie interact together, and learn more about their relationship. I want to know more about why he didn't visit his mother while she was in prison, even though he was the oldest, had the most memories of her. I can understand Hakeem to a degree, he was the baby and he didn't really know her, but I wonder what Andre's excuse was for not visiting her. Maybe he was ashamed of the situation she was in.

This was so good. How could any soap fan not love Cookie? What really surprised me is that I don't hate Lucious despite the fact that he treats his son terribly and murdered his best friend in cold blood. Lucious definitely still loves Cookie, imo. Even when she came in to blow up his meeting, you could see the admiration in his eyes.

Very glad to see this show got some good ratings. I hope they stick. Fox shows are known for bleeding out, but I'm hopeful.

One thing I am liking about the writing for the character of Lucious, is how in spite of all of his many flaws, his sons still love him and want his approval. None of his sons hate him. Not Andre, who I think he gets along well with, not the youngest Hakeem, who reminds him a lot of himself and who he had a bonding moment with last night in the club.

Not even Jamal who he mistreats. Even Jamal loves him, calls him "Daddy", and wants to spend time with him. Many times on a family drama/soaps, there tends to be at least one kid (sometimes more) who dislikes their father/is plotting to take him down.But that's not going on here. I find that refreshing. All of the sons, even Andre the schemer, just want what he promised one of them they could have.

I appreciate that the writers aren't doing a "Which one of us gets to take down Dad first" type of storyline with Lucious and the sons. At least they aren't doing it for now, lol.

double post

I am loving this show so far. Taraji is doing great.

KMan, (for some reason I am having a hard time quoting posts)

I agree that Lucious seems like he could still have a thing for Cookie. He had a little sparkle in his eye, when he was looking at her in his office. Also, I am enjoying the relationship between Jamal and Hakeem. I like the bond that they have, and how well they get along with each other, even though they are very different from each other and even though one is favorite by Lucious, while the other is favorite by Cookie. I also like how Jamal and Hakeem work together musically. I am looking forward to more scenes between the two young brothers. Even though older Brother Andre is already developing trifling plans to pit them against each other, lol.

I am looking forward to this show too. I am liking what I have seen so far of Cookie and Jamal's interaction. I look forward to watching him and Cookie interact and watching her interactions with all her boys and Lucious.. I Think that's going to be good stuff. and I think that the rest of the family will have some interesting layers as well. I think that at least most of them might have at least something worth rooting for, (even if they have some negative qualities as well).

I hope this does well. I think there is a good chance it will. It's in a competitive spot, but maybe the lead in from American Idol will help. Maybe the musical element of the show will really help it, I'm looking forward to the music and also the fashion that will be featured on this show.

double post.

^ Yep. I thank God that I'm not at a particularly vulnerable (Poor, old, unemployed, disabled) point of my life right now because it seems to be an every person for themselves mentality. I'm optimistic enough to think this won't last, but it really sucks for now.

What upsets me more than anything is that thanks to the fear and general stupidity of the public, corrupt, destructive, dangerous governors got a free pass to unleash even more hell on their states. I'd expected Rick Scott, and Brownback didn't surprise me either, but Maine voters reelecting that moron LePage? Why? Because he jumped up and down about ebola?

These states are going to burn, and those who suffer the most will be those who didn't even vote for these lunatics.

Beyond devastated that my favorite Senator...Kay Hagan loss to that jerk in NC.

I'm from NC, did my early voting Saturday, and I am very disappointed that Kay Hagan lost to Thom Tillis. I had figured it would end up being close ,but had hoped that she would pull out the win. Now that she has lost I am very concerned and worried about the future of NC. This state is already struggling a lot financially, and has issues in many areas, I think that the election of Thom Tillis to the Senate could make things far worse for the state. There are many important things and areas, that he has cut funding in (like education, including passing policies that have hurt teachers and college students) Plus he's made pretty harsh comments/has harsh views against the poor, and more vulnerable groups of people.

There is a very long list of important issues he's pushed for policies against, that have had big impact on the people of NC. I think that him being elected to the Senate could end up being pretty detrimental for the state of NC. I know that a lot of people are angry at the Democrats and the leadership of this country and wanted a change, but I wonder how many of them really have thought things through before they cast their vote. It definitely feels like some people just went on a knee jerk reaction. I feel like states like NC, who are already bad off in several ways, are going to suffer even more now, especially economically. I think that some people haven't thought about how bad things could end up getting in at least some of these states, like NC.

I like this show and I either like or don't mind most of the family members. The ones I really don't care for are Rob and Kylie. IMO, Rob and Kylie are both spoiled and I don't like the way that Rob acts a lot of the time. He doesn't seem very motivated to do anything for himself. I don't like the way he verbally attacks people (like Scott) when they achieve any sort of success. He likes to hit below the belt when he verbally insults people.

At times, I haven't cared much for Kris or Kourtney and I'm kind of indifferent to Lamar, but other than that I like/don't mind most of the family. Including Kim, (who I like), Khloe, Kendall, Bruce, and Scott. I really enjoy Mason, he seems like a great kid.

I think that a lot of times Kim is self-absorbed but I still like her and I think that she cares about her family.

Didn't they say this man had called the police about 40 times in recent months?

I heard he had called the police several times on people (mostly black men) in recent months. I heard one report on the news that he called the police on a black seven year old boy, because the seven year old looked suspicious. This man needs to be arrested. I agree with Eric83 that not all black youth wear sagging pants, and I don't think there's anything wrong with hoodies. Plus I heard it was raining that night, and if so, it makes even more sense that Trayvon was wearing a hoodie.

I am glad that this case is getting national attention, this type of stuff has got to stop. I actually think that one of the reasons why it is getting so much attention is because Trayvon doesn't look like a "thug" or "criminal" or any or other bad stereotype that some people like to put black people into. He looks like an innocent looking baby faced teenager and that resonates with a lot of people including people that aren't black. His parents seem like decent people too. This doesn't seem like a child that was a bad person or came from a rough background.

He looks like he could be a lot of people's child,brother, nephew, cousin, child's best friend etc. It even reminds a lot of non black people of their own kids. Kids who like things like Skittles and Ice-T. I've seen multiple white people say he reminds them of their own children. It's not just black people that feel that way about him.

I think that this is one of the biggest reasons why this case is getting so much attention. You can't go around killing teens for being black (and/or even if you take race out of it), for being teens. And because you think someone looks suspicious. Lots of teens (and adults) wear hoodies not just black ones.

I don't think that Geraldo should have said what he said. He should have known he would go under fire for that. Newt just needs to hush, trying to create a problem with Obama's comments about Trayvon where there isn't one. Also I actually think that if President Obama had a son he might would have looked like Trayvon. IMO, Trayvon's skin tone does kind of look like Michelle's and Sasha's and his ears are similar to the presidents. And the structure of his cheeks kind of resembles some of the first family members. With the side by side pictures of the two, yes I actually could see Obama having a son that looks like that. But nonetheless Newt's comments about Obama's were ridiculous and unneccessary.

I don't know what will end up happening to George Zimmerman, but I think he will end up paying for this somehow. Even if he doesn't end up getting convicted. At least this case shines light on big problems that needs to be dealt with like the profiling/stereotyping of certain racial groups in this country.)

Did anyone else watch Dr. Drew tonight? He had on Whitney's ex sister in law (Bobby's sister) and some of her and Bobby's nephews. The former sister-in-law stated that she thought Ray J supplied Whitney with drugs and that Whitney told her that Ray J wasn't really anything to her. She said that Whitney said they weren't romantically involved.

The sister-in-law and nephews also said that they suspected foul play and that the people around Bobby Kristina, had her phone number changed and they couldn't really contact her like they wanted. The sister-in-law also said that when she first heard that Whitney had died, she automatically thought it was because of cocaine. And even said something to the effect of someone gave Whitney a "bad bag". The sister-in-law also said that Whitney never liked to use public tubs because she thought they were dirty and how her and the sister-in-law used to joke about that. She said she thought it was strange how Whitney was found in the tub.

I think that someone probably did get rid of the cocaine in the room, before the cops got there.