Ben

I've already forgotten what she did.

She had a lot of confidence issues, and was using her sexuality to manipulate men. She mostly had story with Paul and Sheila, who made her see that she was worth more than what she thought, and how she needed to have more respect for herself. Paul thought she was a skank at first, but was attracted to her when she changed her image. He paid her (like an escort) to keep a councillor sweet, who he wanted to bride in order to obtain his vote to push through his development of the Eclipse Apartments. But, the councillor wanted sex, and Paul wanted Rhiannon to seduce him and tape it, but she refused and ratted Paul out to the cops. She left to be with her son, who she felt was a bad mother, b/c she couldn't afford to buy him a birthday present.

I know Rhiannon proved popular with a lot of viewers. Probably b/c she was quite different and had emotional layers.

Kym Valentine (ex-Libby) is suing FreMantleMedia for "pain, hurt and humiliation".

http://www.theage.com.au/entertainment/tv-and-radio/neighbours-star-kym-valentine-sues-over-pain-hurt-and-humiliation-20130725-2qmv6.html

The DS article says that she would like to return, which seems a bit odd when you're suing your bosses.

Can't see Libby returning now, unless they rehire the recast.

Hey Ed,

I'm sorry to hear you've been having problems - I hope they're all sorted out now. I know what you mean about these posts being quite in depth. I wanted to reply the other day, but it was too hot to be typing out a lengthy reply on the laptop.

I've made a couple of replies stating pretty much the same on NFans (I'm Benjy over there) about my thoughts on the current show (in the Aus discussion section). I think they tried to fix everything too soon, and after eclipse week, the show became all about the plot, and all the underdeveloped Turners and Willies were shoved front and centre, and they've crashed and burned. I've never warmed to the Turners since they first arrived, b/c they've been plot driven and have yet to be developed in anyway. I enjoyed all of the returns, but all of them could have been longer. During those few months the show was pacey and dramatic, but still the characters were there, and maybe that's b/c they have history to back them up; there was also a good balance of characters and storylines. Sarah's and Steph's returns could have been longer, but they were good and decently written; Lucy's and Mark's were too short - Lucy was treated as a plot device, while Mark was pointless (it's unrealistic that Kate would not chose Mark over Mason). Lucy should have been treated with more respect, and Mark shouldn't have returned until further in the year, once we had seen more of Kate and Mason as a couple. I did think Carla Bonner was phenomenal with her acting - she never missed a beat at all. Seriously, Steph should have returned permanently.

Angie's return was awesome, but they ruined it when she randomly disappeared from the wedding and didn't feature in any key scenes. In fact, the explosion saw a lot of characters just disappear and reappear like they were never there. Flashing forward 5 days and skipping over Priya's and Rhys' funerals and all the initial aftermath was a big mistake, IMO. I think they dropped the ball not making Rhys's death impact Vanessa and Lucas' relationship a lot more. I was also disappointed that they didn't bring Connor back for wedding after he returned only a few months previously.

ITA with you about the current state of the show. The Turners are so underdeveloped and the Willises are lacking in distinct personalities, that I don't care about any of them. But, they've thrust them all into story from the bat, and it hasn't worked; they should have been introduced slowly, especially considering they are 9 new characters, and that's a lot in a small space of time. I feel the Turners have eaten through mountains of plot in the space of 4 months, which should have lasted them the majority of the year. Now, we're stuck with boring, dull plots about Lauren and Brad's past and all the faux drama over the Brad sketch. I still don't know how they work as a family, but some how, I'm supposed to care. The Willises are slightly better, as Terese is the best of the bunch, and Imogen is likebale, and you're right about Bailey being the best of the Turners. I think the Turners were miscast, especially Lauren, who doesn't resemble any form of her old character. I don't understand how they could create two new families and not give at least one family distinct personalities with layers. Epic fail.

Amber's a total disappointment; she's so whiny and needy, and I don't know why, considering her family don't display any of these issues. Her friendship with Chris was random and forced, and they could have made more of her being a Tash replacement for him. It's kinda insulting that she went from crushing on Chris, to pinning and stalking Josh the falling week. Josh comes off very self absorbed and not that likeable. Matt is Michael Williams 2.0. Like you say, Brad is a pointless return. And to think, this family has another sister on a Canadian exchange, and of course Beth's long lost daughter waiting in the wings, yet the Robinsons have been reduced to Paul, who has been kicked out of Ramsay Street! Shameful. LOL.

ITA with all you said about Kyle's blindness and him and Kate sleeping together - just awful. That whole blind story made him stupider for the sake of the plot, which made him very annoying and unlikeable - his whole merry-go-round with Georgia was dragged out and boring. Georgia used to have spirit, but now she's miserable and annoying; I was disappointed with how they wasted Scotty's return, which didn't shed any light on his character at all. The whole Georgia/Kyle/Kate thing is a rehash of Jade/Kyle/Kate and that was only last year!

You're right, the pacing is uber fast, and it's too much. One of the reasons why I don't like Kate & Mason, is b/c their relationship has happened way too fast, and I just think it was a mistake pairing Kate with a younger guy. She works better as a character with older characters, as younger ones always involve her in immature plots and they always make her annoying. II also think it was a mistake moving Kate into #26, she should have stayed w/ Paul. I do like how they are trying to ground Paul a bit with Terese pulling him up over him taking liberties from Lassisters. I also quite liked the sexual harassment story with Caroline, as it wasn't (surprisingly) preachy at all, but had a good central message - Caroline was also a decent guest character, too.

I also haven't liked how everyone is in their own little bubbles, and not really interacting with other characters. Chris shared no scenes with Lucas during his cancer story, and it felt like he didn't even know Lucas had cancer; as a community, no-one seems to care about others as much as they should. I don't know what was going on with Jackie Woodburne, but they wrote her out for a long time, during a period when Susan was needed in a lot of story, like the climax to Rani and Ghost Priya, the Twitter war story, and Steph's return. Every scene is about moving the plot forward, nothing is about advancing characters. Mark should have shared decent scenes with Lucas and Kyle, while Lucy needed time to reconnect with Paul and get to know Kate. We also seen nothing of Karl & Susan's relationship since they reunited.

I'm one of those viewers who think's Mason's a terrible actor, complete with poor characterisation and bad writing overall. How he's written and how he comes across are polar opposites. He was only hired for his looks. The same for wooden Pete the barman, and ditto for Matt and Josh. I wasn't fussed over Rhiannon to begin with, and it was only in her last week that I really warmed to her. But, I tired of the newbies, and I think I wasn't very receptive to her b/c of her connection to the terrible Mason.

I've actually quite liked the Callum/Rani/Bailey triangle, but not the play - too many play rehearsal scenes than was necessary, IMO. I love the Ghost Priya story, and thought Priya's death really gave Coco Cherin a chance to shine as an actor. I still miss Priya, too. I don't believe her pregnancy was the reason she was written out, as the timeline between writing the scripts, filming and Menik learning she was pregnant don't fit at all. I don't believe she would down a return, for the same reasons you mentioned. I think with the creation of the Turners and Willises, I think Richard Jasek only ever planned for the Kapoors to stay a year (give or take). This would explain the rushed nature of the affair with Paul. In an ideal world, they could have done so much more with Paul & Priya. I've become fans of both Rani and Ajay, and for some reason I think while they would have left anyway, I do think Sachin probably did want to go to Hollywood. I just find it odd how no-one had said one way or the other whose decision it was to get rid of Priya.

What do you think of Lucas leaving and the possibility that it may not have been his decision to leave? I've hated how they've treated Lucas & Vanessa in terms of not having a stable home. They are a new, young family, and I think there's still a lot more story to tell with them. I don't think they've handled Lucas' cancer all that well. It started off good, but since Steph left and his treatment began, it all became a throwaway line. With Lucas leaving, what will that mean for Vanessa? They're one of the best couples on the show, and I think it's a mistake getting rid of either one of them.

Me to. I love Lucas & Vanessa as a couple; they're one of the best on the show (they don't have much competition considering half the cast is new).

I just hope Vanessa isn't leaving as well.

As for the baby, I've heard people say they're "Team Put In Care."

ITA Carl, with everything you said.

So many PTB mix up character and archetype. EE have relied on archetypes when creating characters for the last several years, and look where that's got them: repetition Hell! Blanche was a character, and that can't be recreated. It's not like bringing in another bitch, or a loveable loser, and injecting some personality.

And, yes, Deirdre should be a serious character. When she goes all "comedy", she always looks really stupid.

You say there was no point in bringing Dennis back, but there was equally no point in randomly relating him to Julie and Eileen.

While every soap is trying to be edgy and pacey, and keep viewers attention, they all forget that it was characters who defined their respective shows, and it's characters who are at the heart of every soap.

I'm quite disappointed in how they handled Gloria. Sue Johnston is an acclaimed actor, and I feel they let her down by creating such a mediocre character. Gloria is so unlikeable, when really she should have had more redeeming features. I think they got bogged down trying to recreate a Blanche-esque character, and failed. This is Sue Johnston, people should be sad she's leaving and want her to return, not be happy she's going.

I haven't watched this show for a while. Last episode I saw, was Tina bringing the baby home after deciding to keep him. I'm not sure who's team I'm on with this. Maybe b/c it's a predictable twist, or maybe I just don't care. I do feel Tina has come out of all this a stronger character, and her and Tommy do make a decent couple that have been well thought out. I do think the surrogacy laws need to be changed, as it isn't fair that the surrogate is classed as the legal mother, when biologically she isn't related. What are the surrogacy laws in the US?

Those floods are so terrible. Governments really need to start taking climate change seriously. On a positive note, I love the buildings; they look like have a lot of character. I love character buildings.

It seems German soaps are quite good at seeing what works and what doesn't, and implementing change. Would I be right in surmising that producers aren't as attached to their characters, and value the audience opinion more? Like, a lot of times UK soaps will be stuck with dead-end characters for years or in some cases, for ever, even though the viewers do not like them. When Neighbours introduced the Parker family, they were so unliked by the viewers, but loved by the producer, and stayed on for longer than they should have, or at least remained unchanged, until the actors decided to quit.

I hope I haven't posted these before. Difficult to keep track after I reorganized everything and what I had posted no show works!

Sally has a dozen affairs? Doesn't matter, because if someone else does, she will sneer at them. Carla supports Sally through cancer? Doesn't matter, because Sally will accuse her of crying rape and scheme to take her company away. Sally and Tyrone bond over the adultery of their spouses? Doesn't matter, because she will accuse him of beating his wife.

Word to all of that.

That's one of the my biggest problems with how they've written Sally over the last few years. She's been such an after thought that they've ruined her in a lot of ways. They developed Sally's relationships with other characters, and then later trash them. While I liked Sally the Snob, their was no character progression; she just woke up one day and became a pushy mum, who looked down on everyone. I thought it was a relatable story for Sally to live vicariously through Rosie, but not in the way they did it.

I'm not sure if ruining Leanne was designed to prop Peter & Carla, considering they haven't come out of it unscathed.

Deirdre is another character whom they have (almost) ruined in the last year. They just seemed to forget (or didn't care) how characters should react to certain events, and instead we got a lot of judgemental acts. I've lost count how many times the entire street poured scorn on someone when a scandal broke. No balance whatsoever. Paul's wife has Alzheimer's and dies - Eileen is blamed, and everyone turned on her; Tyrone is abused by Kirsty, but she lies and says he hit her, so everyone turns on him; Sunita dies and is framed for arson, so everyone turns on her; Carla is raped by Frank Foster, but he's not charged, so everyone sides with him. I don't remember a time when the Street had such a zombie-mob mentality. It's so stupid how the characters who pass mass judgement never learn, as they all have to eat humble pie each and every time.

Seriously, how many years have they all known Tyrone and Sunita, and still they all believe he's a wife beater and she's a fire starter!

Richard Thorp (Alan Turner) has died.

RIP. Alan was a pretty good character in his hey day.

http://www.itv.com/emmerdale/news/actor-richard-thorp-passes/

Well, I think Corrie can be realistic and unrealistic - it just depends on the context one is referring to.

Gary wanting a baby so desperately is unrealistic in terms of his character and where he was prior to this plot. It has never made any sense. He never wanted to settle down in that way, and his and Izzy's relationship is relatively new in terms of how long they've been together. Tina being a paid surrogate has had zero consequences from the community, and considering it is illegal in the UK to pay someone to be a surrogate. it seems unrealistic that no-one has objected to this and dobbed them into the cops. There is a lot of drama they could have mined from this. I do hate how Owen continually gets away with bullying people into submission - he bullied Tina into becoming a surrogate which killed her relationship with Tommy, and faces no consequences. Izzy didn't really want a baby to begin with, not after suffering a miscarriage and deciding it was best they didn't bother. This story was really badly executed to begin with, and that has had a knock-on effect.

The Bookies being in a financial ruin doesn't make sense to me. Due to the recession, in the last couple of years more and more betting shops have appeared all over the place, sometimes door-to-door! More people are gambling and getting into debt to repay existing debt. So, Peter should be pulling in a trade. No-one cares if the décor is dated and tired, or if they'll get free tea - all they care about is winning money. If they wanted to be somewhat plausible then maybe they should have focused on the big chain stores that have taken over the betting scene.

jfung: I'm glad you can see how Leanne is acting hard done by with Peter. It's this attitude that many fans hate. Leanne was a popular character, and that popularity has taken a dive over the last 2 years. She really needs to own her [!@#$%^&*] and realize that she's no saint. Peter and Carla have moved on, but Leanne continues to scowl and snipe, even though she's got custody of Simon and is married to Nick.

Leanne only started being hypocritical a year ago, when the whole Nick/Leanne/Peter/Carla quad started and they all fought over custody of Simon.

Leanne entered the show as what you would call, white trash; her whole family* were loud, brash and the neighbours from hell. Over time she got into drugs, terminated her baby with Nick, got involved in several lover triangles, became a call girl (one of her clients was Carla's husband and Michelle's brother, Paul, who later died). Leanne was always feisty, bitchy, and never afraid of a bit of blackmail. In 2011, Leanne cheated on Peter with Nick. They got back together. Then Peter cheated on her with Carla. And this was when Leanne started acting saintly, and hypocritical towards Peter - she was being written like she had never done anything wrong, like she'd never had affairs or broken up her precious little family with Simon before. Peter and Carla were written as the villains, while Leanne was acting out of character, and became void of all empathy and balance. And that's still the case today. She still acts saintly, she's still hypocritical in her assessments of other characters, of Peter and Carla, even though she was prostituting herself with Carla's husband when he died!

This is one of the reasons why I'm not looking forward to the whole Nick/Kylie baby secret being exposed, b/c Leanne will probably act all hard done by, and once again she'll be the betrayed victim, even though her and Nick weren't together at the time b/c Leanne was still fawning over Peter. What makes Leanne hypocritical around Karl, is that her suspicions are not b/c she suspects he's a killer, but b/c he's a cheat and Stella has taken him back, even though Leanne has first hand experience in that department - she wouldn't be with Nick now, if he hadn't of taken her back; she wouldn't have had a second go with Peter if he hadn't of taken her back. None of these storylines are 2 dimensional, they are layered, and the characters involved should be written as layered individuals. Leanne shouldn't trust Karl, but at the same time she should understand how important it is for him to have a second chance.

*Leanne's family originally consisted of her father Les Battersby, step-mum Janice, and half-sister Toyah. It was only when Stella arrived last year that Leanne learned that Stella was her bio mother. I feel they probably changed Leanne's personality show she would fit in better with Stella, Eva and Gloria.

jfung, you should be seeing Audrey soon, and a bit more of David, too.

I don't think I've ever found it too difficult to get into an American soap. When I started watching OLTL in 2009, I never had to do too much research. I remember asking a couple of questions here about Carlotta and how she was related to Tea (obviously she isn't) and a couple of others. I think it helped that I joined the show at the time when Mitch had returned, so they were recapping all the complicated Buchanan connections. I think Y&R was the one that I really struggled to get into in 2008 (it took several months before I was comfortable watching the show, but due to the downward quality in writing, I barely lasted 6 months). I don't think watching a soap should be a struggle; you'll know if it suits you or not, as not all soaps are everyone's cup of tea.

Lord Mercedes get it together gurl!!! I hope they get rid of that Browning guy cuz he seriously scares me. I'll have to find out more about the Lindsey character but I can't support Merci if she gonna be linked up with a killer.

Mercedes did some pretty unforgivable things last year; her and Dr. Browning are HO's answer to Bonnie & Clyde! Riley was apparently the love of her life, but she slept with his dad, Carl, and got pregnant. Riley's granddad Silas, murdered several people, and kidnapped Mercy and held her captive in the basement of The Dog (the pub), where she ended up giving birth, I think. Riley had moved on with Mitzeee, so Mercedes stalked her. Mitzeee started taking anti-anxiety meds; Mercy found out and drugged her, making her trip out. This was when Mercy knocked Mitzeee unconscious and stabbed herself, framing poor Mitzeee for the crime. Mitzeee went to jail, and Mercy got back with Riley. But he only wanted a relationship with his son. So, Mercy kidnapped her own son, launched a televised appeal, and when the truth was exposed, she threatened to throw herself and her son off the roof of an apartment block! She ended up being sectioned to a psych ward where she went a little nutty for a couple of weeks (you were never sure if she was faking to escape a jail sentence). Riley was shot and died, and Mitzeee left town with Carl and Riley's son to start a new life in California. During all this, Mercy struck up a relationship with twisted Dr. Browning who tried to prostitute her. Lynsey stopped her. Lynsey later found out that Mercedes stabbed her self and framed Mitzeee, so Browning killed her to protect Mercy. At the world's most implausibe trial, both Mercy and Dr. Browning got away with their respective crimes.

Dr. Browning isn't going anywhere. They wrote him into a corner and should have left once his guest stint was over, but BK (the exec producer) loved him so much, he gave him a reprieve and upped him to the permanent cast.

As for Will, he seems very unpopular, and I can see why. He really needs to leave soon, especially since he murdered Texas. But again, BK loves Will and his war with Dodger. I hate the fact that Texas never learned the true extent of will's deception, like his stalking her with CCTV camera planted all over the village. I feel cheated that we never more scenes with Texas learning the truth, instead of this pointless whodunit? that lasted for 2 episodes. They may as well have given us some great scenes w/ Texas and Will and shown us Will pushing Texas out of the window in the first place. It wouldn't have made no difference to what we are seeing now.

Apparently Robert Mamone (Sid Walker) has been let go.

He tweeted saying it's b/c he spoke up for the truth.

https://twitter.com/RobMammone/status/333159195836817409

Intriguing. Sounds like H&A may have some backstage issues. Shame. Whenever I watch, I've always thought Sid had long term potential. He is a decent character. If the reasons are true, I think it gives out a bad message to fire someone who stands up for the truth. I guess it depends on what the "truth" actually is.

I didn't really feel much for Anna, even when Faye had lied about Anna hitting Faye.

Enjoying Mary being unexpectedly good with Dev's kids.

I think Anna/Owen/Faye/Tim are stuck in a rut. Faye does nothing for family, and never has. Anna is a decent character, so it's a little annoying that she's stuck in such a dead-end story... or at least it's quite dead at the moment. It needs to be pacier.

Surprising, Mary has come into her own as Mary Poppins looking after the Alahan kids. I've never really liked Mary, but she just clicks with Dev - not romantically. I also like the development with Dev and Sophie's friendship.

I'm glad Katy is done with Chesney. He ruined their relationship himself, and I think Katy and Ryan have potential.

I'm liking Peter & Carla finally moving forward. It's so good seeing them just being a couple. These days so many couples never get to just be a couple, they just lurch from one drama to another with little time to invest. So this is good. They feel more cemented, and I like that Carla is excepted into the Barlow family. Meanwhile, Leanne continues to grow as a hypocrite; she's fallen so far from who she once was.

For anyone interested who doesn't know these exist.

Steph Webisodes 1-4 detailing her time in prison just before she was released. These were directed by Scott Major who plays Lucas.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B6_kmPRC5Ds

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dCbmNpbzlsY

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SjCnat9XWiA

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OCOlC1CBpSg

Eclipse promo

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MUgxYEGvpuE

This is supposed to be a big episode, like a season finale with lots of big things happening.

Thanks. I guess Paul was a nice guy at this time.

Errol said that he thought OLTL and AMC were somewhat similar to Neighbours. If you ever get a chance to see them, I hope you can weigh in.

Paul was a nicer character back then, but he did have his bad boy moments - he's always been a bit of a schemer at heart, just a generally nicer guy at heart.

Really, Errol said that?! I guess he's talking about the 2.0 versions, right? Oh, I'll be watching new OLTL for sure (thanks to Google Chrome and a handy little plug-in, I'll be able to watch on Hulu, which is so awesome). I guess, from what I've seen of the previews, and if I imagine Llanview as a suburban street, I can see what Errol kind of means. I'd say it could be Neighbours with a PG rating.

Yes, Gail.

Some people think she was his one true love. FYI: Gail... or the Swing Out Sister woman, is the mother of the triplets: Elle, Cameron and Robert.

Paul arrives at the party with Gail at 1.50.

Thank you Huntress for those detailed family trees. They paint a clearer picture.

Thanks Huntress for the reply. It explains a lot.

I think it's interesting that you can see how TV trends have impacted on the soaps - telenovelas, now reality soaps (I don't get why people like them). Soaps have taken a lot of knocks, yet they still keep on fighting. Dumbing down is such a vexing TV trend. I think it's sad when a show feels they have to change beyond recognition in order to compete, and still it never really solves the problems, but adds to them.

I'm glad UU hasn't changed too much, and is character driven. I think you can incorporate OTT stories and still develop the characters. I guess it shows that RTL have faith in their soaps, otherwise they would cancel them.

I guess the very nature of constantly revamping, that instability, would drive me away from the shows.

ETA: Looking at those preview photos, I notice the soaps are very young; they don't appear to have a cross-generational appeal, as there doesn't seem to be many older characters. If there are, they aren't appearing in the previews, which leads me to suspect they aren't involved in a storylines. FYI: By older, I mean 50s, 60s, 70s... Are they family based? Like, Neighbours has only just gone back to families, and Hollyoaks is trying to do the same, and that brings a totally different tone to the shows, a more relateable feel.

I don't visit this thread much, but when I do the German soaps always seem to be revamping. Are they constantly chasing ratings or simply following trends?

One or the other always seems to have a hostage/murder/birth drama, and I always feel like they're quite OTT - is this a fair assessment? Or can they be quite character driven?

What constitutes high and low ratings in Germany? Why don't viewers stick with the soaps? They seem to go through a revamp every year, yet people don't seem to stick with them. Is it b/c soaps are no longer popular?

Sorry for all the questions Huntress. My previous post was probably better worded until it vanished.

The first article is incomplete. I found their characters dead boring, anyway. Justin was such a drip, Kelly was beautiful, and could have done much better.

Sean was the one who was murdered. I know what you mean, as those stories all follow the same pattern.

I'm just watching those bloopers that you posted, Carl, and some are pretty funny. I'd forgotten that Kate O'Mara guest starred as Chrissy's mum. 7:17 is a good example why actors shouldn't take "normal" mouthfuls of food. At 20:03 when the actors couldn't see a thing through all the smoke - Caleb: "I fell awkwardly". Denise:"I can't see [!@#$%^&*]!"