EricMontreal22

Are these episodes on YT?  I only vaguely started watching then.  Man it still amazes me all the turnaround Loving had despite staying under (to some degree) Agnes Nixon's control.

On 11/3/2018 at 3:19 AM, Goldensoaps said:

oh yes!!!! And Search for tomorrow with Liza and Travis in Hong Kong (I think)........ RH in Irland I think it was in 1977...so maybe RH was the first soap doing this...

In soap trivia books (which often get details wrong) AMC's honeymoon in St Croix is listed as the first international location shoot (apparently the show was so popular there that they aired in prime time).  (Although technically St Croix is a constituent district of the US...)  It seems like it was a particularly popular tourist place for Americans around that time--you don't hear about it nearly as much now...

I completely agree--I think McT (during that era anyway) and Broderick would have balanced each other out well.  And yeah--it got very one note and bleak. 

It started to fall apart near the end of McTavish's run at that time--so many doubles, got very dark and violent, etc--which was why FMBehr fired her, but I still strongly agree.

I attended a conversation with Maupin a bit back where he hinted at some of this casting (well he told us one bit outright and then said we better not repeat it since it wasn't official yet...) but I'm really pleased with everything I've heard about the miniseries so far.  And I'm thrilled that Paul Gross is back as Brian--one of several recasts for the later season where I didn't much like the new actor (I know Gross was busy with his TV work at the time)  Story wise it sounds like it picks up with the 8th book, Mary Ann in Autumn which age wise makes complete sense and casting a young Anna makes me think it'll also use elements from the 9th, final book, The Days of Anna Madrigal which is largely a flashback to her childhood, but I know we're meant to get new stories, etc, along with these.  Maupin isn't writing any of the scripts (which is fine by me--Richard Kramer did the first series script which was great--Maupin did the not as successful later adaptations) but he is mapping out the new storylines and is fully on board.  

It's too bad this means we'll miss some of the bits I liked best in the 4-6 books (I assume some of the Michael Tolliver stuff will be incorporated from the 6th book which is, unlike the soap structure of the others, all his story), but they would have had to have recast all the roles realistically (Maupin did write a script for the fourth book, Babycakes, which was briefly in development at Showtime 15 years back).

Yeah, Malone didn't seem to fight for it too much to be honest--or at least he was resigned to the issues at the time.  In interviews I found from the time he admits how pleasantly surprised they were at how much audiences like Billy--saying originally the focus was gonna be on Andrew.  He's quoted in a Michael Logan article on Daytime Taboos from Sep 1993 saying that "it's one thing to do a story abou t homophobia but it's quite another to explore the life of a gay character or couple a life that includes sex and such problems such as gay adoption.  I doubt that day will ever come. :

SOunds right.  Interestingly the same article said that even if they were brave enough (their words) to keep Billy on, it would have to be recast because Ryan had just booked the NBC primetime "soap miniseries" The Secrets of Lake Success which they hoped would be successful enough to be a series (I'd never heard of it--though I see it's on DVD so I guess it wasn't.)  Variety's review starts off: 

When the Atkins family patriarch dies, the town of Lake Success is inundated with more gold diggers than a Dean Martin roast. Resultant fast-paced soaper may be -- however inadvertently -- the funniest series on primetime TV, with florid acting and script on a campy level that makes "Dallas" look like "King Lear." Pity it's only scheduled for three two-hour installments, concluding Oct. 15.

7 minutes ago, robbwolff said:

I thought he appeared the following year for Andrew's bachelor party. Shortly after, he was written out.

I'm not sure and though I was watching, I don't remember and YT is little help.  When would the bachelor party have been?  I found the mention of his one off appearance for AIDS day (when all the soaps in 1993 agreed to do something for that day--June 21) in an essay on the storyline.

7 minutes ago, Paul Raven said:

June 26 1992 Billy came out to Andrew, so I guess that was the beginning of the story.

The AIDS quilt was displayed  late August

WHich was basically the end of the story (I think they had a bit more with Billy and Ricky his bf, etc but then it faded away--his dad never even "came around"--I found one interview that said Malone had a story with them going on a double date with Joey and a girl but for whatever reason it never happened)  Thanks!

A question as to dates that I need for my grad paper and can't nail down--does anyone have the dates, even months, that the homophobia storyline played out on OLTL?  Even just down to appearances by Billy Douglas.  I know it was over several months during the Summer of 1992 (and that Billy showed up once more the following year for AIDS day *rolls eyes*)

37 minutes ago, Paul Raven said:

The shooting on Cutting Edge was Th and Fri Feb 8&9 1996.

Thank you so much!

Does anyone know the date, or week that Michael Delaney was shot on the Cutting Edge?  I'm trying to find a better copy on youtube than the clips with the Turkish (??) subtitles but even that doesn't give a date...

Wow I had no idea that Don Wallace was on the writing team in 1986.

7 hours ago, j swift said:

It's amusing to note that both Babbin and Sleasar wrote mysteries about killing producers on soap sets; a bit of hiding in plain sight. 

Ha!  I\m trying to find a file I have saved from Babbin about being an openly gay woman in the industry, she pulls no punches!

Depending on her prose quality, sounds potentially fun.  I never got why she was replaced at AMC--did she leave on her own?

2 hours ago, robbwolff said:

If I remember correctly, AMC and OLTL used the same sets on occasion, just redressed for the particular show. I remember reading that the coffee shop on OLTL was the same set as Jane's Addiction on AMC.

Yep they absolutely did.  Usually I think they looked different enough, but...

7 hours ago, DRW50 said:

I see Jason in there. I'm going to spare you my long post about how Jason was an OLTL character through and through and how he should have been a much bigger presence than he was. 

I never knew why he was dropped--or did the character leave?  I liked his interactions with Wanda

7 hours ago, victoria foxton said:

 

Thanks so much for these!  A month or so into the Gottlieb/Malone era...  I didn't start watching till whenever the gay story started in 1992, and haven't seen much from this time (I did see on FB some of the short term spousal abuse story with Craig Wasson

6 hours ago, j swift said:

I'm following the classic SOD recaps on Tumblr and we are currently at the Rick Alden murder.  There is also a story about Jacqueline Babbin, who came on as headwriter with a love for writing mystery.  I've totally forgotten the outcome, but so far it is a delightfully constructed story.  Stacy has been set up as a pawn, but she is not doing anything out of character.  The murder brings about the introduction of great side characters like Norma and Paul.  It is exciting that there are so many plausible solutions, even though SOD immediately pokes holes in it by revealing the actor's contracts for key suspects.  What I really appreciate is the "EON-style" of soap mystery wherein the main mystery is exciting, but there are also secrets that will come out at trial, romances that blossom while trying to solve the mystery, and the story propels the plot forward by resolving the Rick/Stacy/Jack triangle rather than being resolved and forgotten.

 

 

Side note: 1989-1990 was a mess of a year for the soaps.  All of the ABC soaps changed executives.  Major characters like Max (OLTL) and Reva (GL) left their shows.  New characters like Dawn (GH) are being recast right and left.  The Daytime Emmys weren't broadcast.  Writers are quitting and then giving very gossipy exit interviews.   It's four years before the OJ trial and the soaps were already in major trouble.

Was Jacqueline Babbin *writing?  She was the EP--I remember one article that I seem to have lost about her hiring where she talks about all the changes she'll make but unfortunately she was only given a year (I love her time at AMC--Wisner Washam said it was she who insisted on a gay storyline with the short lived lesbian story since she was a lesbian).  She could have suggested a mystery to the writer of course...

Yeah the late 80s were a hard time for ABC--all their soap ratings were dropping so they did a lot of surgery--with AMC/OLTL/GH it (at least till the mid 90s) seems to have worked, though.

Thanks!  He was kinda adorable.  Do you just watch these things randomly and come across soap actors?

A lot of people (and mostly fairly) complained about that hospital scene and the fact that some people barely seemed to register that Victor Jr was alive, etc. 

I think you're right that OLTL 2.0 coulda done a better job establishing character relationships and history for new, or long time gone, viewers.  AMC did a much better job with this, but then again they also had the time jump, many more new characters (cast), etc, and so had to--the only story really that was directly picked up was who was shot at the finale, and even that was easily dealt with (let's face it, it would be pretty hard to handle in well written dialogue recap the whole Victor Jr/Todd thing).

Interesting both shows made use of a coffee house setting.  It does seem like a good locale for them to have for group stuff.  --traditionally soaps always use restaurants but who actually goes to restaurants so often, even casual places. 

(Re Ron's GH don't forget he also managed to tie in Ryan's Hope and even Loving to the show when he wrote it--though Loving had a cross over with GH, it is not owned by ABC but was kept by Agnes Nixon's company throughout it and City's run, so I'm not sure if he had any right to do that, but probably no one on either side really cared).

2 hours ago, Darn said:

The music starting at the time stamp in this clip until the end of the scene is outstanding. It's awfully tense yet beautiful.

 

 

They handled Bianca's coming out with such care. The writing, directing and music was on point.

Yeah, at least Nixon went out with a bang.

12 hours ago, DRW50 said:

 

There are some decent elements (like Bianca's story, among others). Part of it is my Greenlee block. I associate her with the worst of AMC.

I liked other things I suspect were Nixon and not Passanante like some sense of a smaller community (poor Marian trying hard to join and fit in with Enid's group, etc)  I thougth Greenlee was tolerable back then but I liked Leo and Leo and Bianca's friendship a lot, etc.

21 minutes ago, DRW50 said:

There were some elements of that run I did really enjoy - much more than the supposed return to form afterward that actually made me quit watching the show - but it was ruined by McTavish veering wildly out of control, as per usual, with things like the Kit Fisher story (I almost typed Kit Fister, which would be another type of story entirely) and Adam tricking Liza into being impregnated with his sperm. 

Yeah, I admit that it's much better in hindsight than I thought at the time--I was surprised (better the devil you know?) although, as you know, I really liked 99-2000 out of the Agnes co-HW time before it completely fell apart.  It still feels like AMC on some level at any rate.

Just posted this week, an episode right smack dab in the middle of the beloved second McTavish run! 

I will say this thread has made me revisit clips, etc, of the online OLTL.  For a variety of reasons the AMC reboot has stuck with me more, and I think overall (despite the issues it had with having less of the ABC cast) I think it was the more successful, but it's reminded how much I enjoyed an awful lot of OLTL 2.0  I think there was a chunk in the middle or maybe early on and in the middle where it felt directionless and it lost the initial momentum, but by the end it really was revving up into something potentially great--and frankly something I enjoyed more than the final years of Ron's run (despite all the whiners about the reboots online--who were particularly bitter about Ron not continuing with the reboot).  It kept some of the convoluted crime stuff OLTL often did what with the secret organization but I was intrigued--even hackneyed soap stories like Jack sleeping (almost?) with his teacher were relatively freshly handled I thought.

As Vee has said several time it also really helped to be back to back with AMC and emphasize the sorta ying/yang thing the two shows, at their best, always had (even, in their old 1970 way, back when they started judging by the 1969 OLTL ep online and the five AMC 1970s eps out there)--AMC being more homey, a bit more "small town", etc, compared to OLTL's more urban and action oriented edge (even with AMC having stories like the sex trafficking one I think this was true).  Hell the two online shows even emphasized that--online AMC seemed to mostly take place in the day, and OLTL mostly at night.

And now I'm sad once again that the reboots didn't work out.  Oh well, better to go out as (mostly) a creative success than to have been the utter embarrassments they could have been.

Ugh and I forgot all of that too.  Of course John McBain had the vampire PC crossover story and then also had to be written off even though he didn't go to OLTL 2.0

Certainly pre-Dale Arden from Flash, Natalie (ugh one of the worst recasts in a show that has had some doozies...)