Xanthe

50 minutes ago, DRW50 said:

ABC also made a run in the mid '90s with Corey Page, Ingo Rademacher and Vince Poletto. I suppose this was another case of the ABC-ification of CBS.

Perhaps Australia was exporting rather than America importing. 

5 minutes ago, Mona Kane Croft said:

Thank you, that information is very helpful!  So based on what we see in the March 6, 1979 (John's death) episode, Michael was still living in John and Pat's former house.  And if John and Michael were living together, then John had returned to the house he had shared with Pat since around 1964-65 (and I believe John lived in that same house with his first wife, who was Lee Randolph's mother).   Thank you again!!

Oh, I'm so glad! I had sort of assumed that Pat would have been living there and ruled it out. I wonder where Pat was. Probably in and out of prison herself.

1 hour ago, Mona Kane Croft said:

Does anyone remember where John Randolph lived after he and Olive split-up?  If my memory is correct, Olive stayed in the big house John had built for her.  But I'm unsure where John lived after their divorce.  Did John return to the house he had shared with Pat?  Where was he living when he died?   

For what it's worth, after Evan's murder, based on the AWHP synopses, John was in the hospital for some time. He was released in March 1978 and apparently wherever he was living, Michael and/or Marianne lived with him. 

I don't see anything on the Addresses page that is obviously John post-Olive. In fact I don't see an address for Olive's grand house.

http://www.anotherworldhomepage.com/address.html

I glanced at the Soaps & Serials novelizations but I'm not sure they cover this period so probably nothing illuminating there.

24 minutes ago, Soapsuds said:

Reunion

Thanks! There is an online auction of memorabilia linked at the end of the article as well for those who might be interested. 

23 hours ago, j swift said:

I'm not running to the bookstore for this, but I'd read a synopsis, just to see if she has any insight into why CBS was so desperate to cast Aussie soap stars in the early 2000s.

Another World had Carmen Duncan and Julian McMahon in the 90s. (I do not mention Joy Bell because I am not aware of any other soap credits for her.)

2 hours ago, DRW50 said:

 I did get to watch most of the Richard Bekins Locher Room today. 

He still looks great for being a few months from 70.

He mentioned being from California and said he wasn't sure why he was hired for a New York show, but he stayed in New York from then on, and still lives there. 

He talked about Maude as one of his first TV roles. He said he was intimidated by Bea Arthur, but Rue McClanahan was very nice. 

He screen tested for the Hardy Boys and lost out to Parker Stevenson. 

He didn't screen test for AW, they just hired him after his audition.

His first scene was with Constance Ford in Ada's kitchen and had a lot of props. He said she was a wonderful mentor and so helpful to him. He also spoke highly of Nancy Frangione and Chris Rich. (Locher said Chris played Blaine - wrong) He also mentioned Rick Porter. He was asked about Kyra Sedgwick and just said she was great and fun. 

He said he could never read the crawl/teleprompter as he's nearsighted, so he had to memorize his lines. He mentioned that he and others changed their lines if they didn't like something, but Beverlee McKinsey and Douglass Watson never did. He also talked about the heavy tape schedule during that year when Jamie was on constantly, as scenes were shot continuously then. He said after he finished his brief role on GL, Beverlee called him, and she called him again a few other times after she moved to Santa Barbara. 

He said he'd still be glad to do a soap (he mentioned GH).

He said he isn't really in touch with anyone he worked with at AW, as many have died, or they didn't stay in New York.

He mentioned working with Meryl Streep in a film, and more about his theater and primetime career. He said his favorite primetime roles were on shows like L&O. 

He said he didn't really know how popular he was as Jamie until the response he got in an airport. He mentioned how popular the show was in Canada. 

They joked about how often he would be shirtless or in his underwear as Jamie.

He talked about putting a lot of his insecurities into Jamie, and how he would have dreams as Jamie, in the Cory living room set.  

He said his favorite story, of what he remembered, was the dynamic between Jamie, Rachel and Mac. He knows people enjoyed his scenes with Rachel.

He mentioned being gay and how it just wasn't talked about. He never opened up to anyone about being gay. He regrets it but just wasn't ready. 

He said he left AW because he wanted to do other things. He said Constance Ford and Paul Stevens encouraged him to leave and told him if he didn't, he'd be stuck there forever like they were.  He had saved all his money at AW so was able to just go into residential theater for a long time. 

He didn't really say much about his ATWT or OLTL roles (he mentioned possibly being a love interest for Robin Strasser on OLTL).

He lived in the same apartment from ages 25-65 and then moved to the West Village. 

He said he's not sure if he will be able to go to AW's 60th anniversary or not.

Nothing that detailed, but even with the usual issues with the Locher format it was nice to see him, and I got the feeling he was surprised to even still have fans after all this time.

Thank you so much for this. I am just starting to watch and his voice feels so familiar even now. 

51 minutes ago, Paul Raven said:

@Xanthe Mentioning LL as Dennis was only in terms of him being cast at that time and aligning more with Jim Poyner's Dennis , rather than any great love for the actor,

Dennis was a sensitive type-growing up in the shadow of a domineering mother, having a heart condition etc .But upon returning in say 1986, he could have been cast and written differently.

As for story,for fun, I wrote daily outlines for AW for that time period. I had Vicky and Dennis involved, causing Iris much angst. Vicky got pregnant by Jake who was trying to rebuild his marriage to Marley. So Vicky decided to have an abortion to solve the whole mess, but was in a car accident before she could do so and the pregnancy was  discovered and Dennis of course believed he was the father. Much drama ensued!

Thanks! The idea of Dennis as a reckless rich racecar-driving playboy that Marley was attracted to despite her better judgement that they went with was good in theory but juxtaposing him with the much hotter IMO Byron Pierce spoiled that for me. If Dennis had been ridiculously hot or charismatic that might have made more sense but neither Chris Bruno or Laurence Lau would have worked for me.

16 hours ago, Paul Raven said:

Laurence Lau as Dennis.

I like most of your ideas but I don't know whether I can see this since most of my frustration with Laurence Lau's Jamie was his stodginess. He was less stiff in some respects than Chris Bruno but I don't think I have my head around what kind of character Dennis should be. I was aware of and just kind of accepted Jim Poyner in the rôle but don't have much of impression.

Do you envision any particular storyline for Dennis?

2 hours ago, Soaplovers said:

At first, when Sandra F came on as Amanda.... Depriest did seem to make an effort to provide some layers to the character of Amanda.  She had Amanda/Rachel have mother/daughter conflict with Amanda not wanting to do the traditional things all girls with money did which drove Rachel a bit crazy because that was all she had wanted for herself and wanted to provide for her daughter.

And I think Amanda wanting to develop her identity beyond being a Cory was promising... as well as her relationship with the more working/middle class Sam helped with that.  I think the 1988 writer strike really kind of derailed that characterization of Amanda.. and she never really had much direction as a character.   I think Sandra F's take as Amanda was probably best and infused her character with some sort of spark/character.. which got lost with the two other recasts.

To each their own but Sandra Ferguson's Amanda never really worked for me. Somewhere between the writing and the performance the threads for a potentially interesting character were lost. I feel like there were several scenes where Julie Anne was required to provide a lot of exposition explaining Amanda's motivations that simply had not been shown to us otherwise. 

Amanda did have some good scenes with Rachel and with Mac but I felt that they didn't do enough to build up her interests beyond Sam so she didn't have enough to fall back after she and Sam got married. It's too bad Amanda and Julie Anne were not part of a larger group of friends which could have helped to broaden their interactions. 

10 hours ago, Efulton said:

The younger brother was Jesse played by Dondre T Whitfield. Dondre went on to some success at All My Children. 

Thanks! The name just wasn't coming to me. I see he was listed in the AWHP Minor Characters and was on for about 1 year (1989). The Lawrences also had a mother, Esther, played by Sandra Reaves Philips who apparently passed away in December.  

17 minutes ago, chrisml said:

Losing Nancy was so odd to me. I have no idea why they didn't recast if Jane Cameron could not be lured back. I could see Judi Evans as Nancy. 

I think they thought Amanda was taking up that space and Nancy would be superfluous, especially after Paulina was introduced. But I think there could have been room for Nancy as well if Amanda had had a properly defined character. 

I also wish that Sandy had showed up at some point. It would have made sense after Mac's death and people fighting for control of Cory -- and given his history with Carl.

22 minutes ago, chrisml said:

The whole Mary saga is so annoying because I so enjoy watching Denise Alexander on the episodes I've rewatched, but it's obvious they didn't have a game plan.  She has chemistry with everyone she interacts with on the show so why write off her family, Reginald, and Scott?  Along the same lines, I wish Sharon Gabet had gone to another soap or they had written for her talents. Her character makes no sense to me when I've watched episodes from her tenure. She seems to have a different personality every episode.

Mary was successful in spite of the writing and in my Reginald-free version Denise Alexander could have been just as good as a different character. Brittany was not successful IMO and she dragged Catlin down with her. There were probably other options for Sharon Gabet that would have been infinitely better. 

15 minutes ago, Contessa Donatella said:

Now, I'm serious. I can't think of who the Lawrences were!

Reuben who was friends with Josie (introduced as Mary's social work client Pilara's possibly abusive boyfriend; they accidentally burned down Mary's Place IIRC). Ronnie a nurse and nightclub singer who dated Zack Edwards. And a younger brother whose name I forget who was a good student.

25 minutes ago, chrisml said:

There are a lot of "I would" statements here. Off the top of my head and I'm sure there are a lot more:

I would have had a definite end game for the Red Swan

I would not have fired Cali Timmins and recast Paulina.

I would not have let Iris Duncan languish in storylines beneath her talent and then write Iris into a corner. 

I would not have had Jake rape Marley. As far as I'm concerned, they could have killed off Jake.

I would not have hired Jensen Buchanan to play Marley/Vicky. 

I would not kill off Frankie.

I would not let JFP or Charlotte Savitz anywhere near the show.

Lumina would never have happened.

Lorna would not have been raped.

I would have made Cecile's return something longterm and interesting. 

Joy Bell and Allison Hossack would have been better integrated in the show and given something to do.

The Lawrences would have been a proper family storyline wise on the show.

1986-1990:

Mary/Reginald story would have been plotted and Reginald would not have been written off so weakly.

Quinn would not have been killed off.

Scott would have gotten the big storyline that was always on the edge of happening. 

Jane Cameron would not have left the show. 

The MJ prostitution story would not have happened. Sally Spencer would have been given something else to do.

 

 

I agree with a lot of these although I would not have brought Reginald back from the dead at all. They could have had Kathleen investigate the past without Reginald and Mary being alive and bring some upsetting facts to light that had repercussions in the present for the McKinnons and the Loves and the Hudsons and the Frames if they wanted to make Jason Nicole's father or whatever, etc etc.

I would have kept Nancy around (but I do agree with the Judi Evans recast suggestion) and done more to make sure she had boyfriends and friends who were linked to the rest of Bay City.

I would have handled the introduction of John completely differently and would not have given him the rape/romance backstory with Donna. 

I would have handled the John/Felicia affair completely differently if it had to happen at all. I can understand a circumstance where John was at a breaking point because of Sharlene's mental illness but he and Felicia should have felt guilty every second of every day.

1 hour ago, Mona Kane Croft said:

If they wanted to do a "throw back" to the show's history -- well, they had Sam Groom in the studio.  He should have played Russ Matthews (Rachel's first husband and Josie's father), but NO.  Let's get a guy in a gorilla costume as a nod to the past.  Brilliant.  Brilliant.

There is more than one point in time in the past to nod to. They were trying to hit different points and neither their use of Sam Groom nor the Gorilla Nostalgia with Bringing Up Baby overtones was fully satisfying. Part of that was, frankly, because over the years they had twisted and broken continuity in so many places that it was hard to make callbacks that would be meaningful. They did a better job (although still not perfect) with the 25th anniversary cameos.

5 hours ago, DRW50 said:

I don't watch Locher too often but I may to see Richard Bekins. Richard's work holds up so well. I wish they had gotten him back in the show's later years. (I also think he was genuinely more attractive than the piece of ass Jamies they cast after him, although Yates and Todd weren't shabby).

Thanks for this. Bekins looks great. I would have been glad to have seen him in the AW finale whether as Jamie or, if they decided that it would be too much dissonance for people who remembered Russell Todd with Jensen Buchanan, in a random cameo.

I still haven't made the time to listen to Stephen Schnetzer's Locher Room, which I also want to get to. I had not realized that he had a role on The Bay. I watched about 5 minutes of one episode and it was not my speed at all so I don't know whether I can or should  make the effort to try to see his part.

13 hours ago, Mona Kane Croft said:

It was established during Mac's first few years on AW, that he was born into a wealthy Manhattan family and that Cory Publishing was at least three generations old at that point.  At one point, Mac admitted to Iris that he had never really loved her mother (his first wife) and that the marriage had been arranged.  This was before Iris's adoption storyline.  He also mentioned to Rachel that his own mother was a controlling woman consumed by social status, who was not very kind or loving.  

This is why the show's 25th anniversary episodes were something of a retcon -- suggesting that the entire company -- Cory Publishing, was only 25 years old in 1989.  There was also a period in the 1990s when the writers retconned Mac's personal background, suggesting he had been a self-made man who created Cory Publishing from scratch.  Too bad they didn't stick with Mac's original origin story, because that is what gave Mac much of his motivation -- both professional and personal.  

There were a lot of points where they didn't bother much about consistency, either because they didn't know or didn't think it mattered (or both).

I found this episode where Alfred and Vivian come to meet MJ. The relationship between Alfred and Mac seems like acquaintances who haven't seen each other in a long time rather than brothers who were brought up together. Jamie (in between daydreaming about Lisa) casually and apropos of nothing mentions how unalike they are.

Mac does mention Alfred's dissertation so that may be where I got the idea he was an academic. 

I don't know whether they ever intended to do more with the characters but it doesn't feel like they put much effort into them.

Just saw that O.J. Simpson has died.

https://www.ctvnews.ca/entertainment/o-j-simpson-has-died-family-says-1.6842823

1 hour ago, AbcNbc247 said:

I could be wrong, but when I was rewatching 1986-1987 on YouTube, those final two weeks of the storyline were the only part that wasn’t included. 

Unless it was an official P&G account, I wouldn't expect there to be a correlation necessarily between what is available on YouTube and what the show actually had preserved. 

On 4/9/2024 at 8:26 PM, Mona Kane Croft said:

It was very strange to suddenly have (not one, but) TWO of Mac Cory's nephews arrive in town as law enforcement officials, with no mention of that being unusual -- considering the multi-generational wealth of the Cory family. Wouldn't it have been expected that someone (Mac? Rachel? Ada? Jamie? The maid? or someone?) might mention how odd it was to have two brothers coming from a millionaire family and choosing law enforcement as a career? Trying not to stereotype, but it was written as if the Corys were suddenly working-class, with two nephews "movin' on up" into law enforcement.  

I'm not suggesting it should have been a huge deal in the scripts, but still it was worthy of mention.   And the situation itself could have made for some good social-class drama, had it not been ignored.  Imagine how Iris would have felt about two of her cousins joining law enforcement?  Or how about Neal and Adam's mother? She could have come to Bay City to express her displeasure about her sons' choices.   Lots of opportunities for class-conflict that were ignored or lost.  Just my opinion, of course.  

There were definitely periods when the show had no real sense of class distinction. When done well there is a distinction between wealth and class and different family members can be affected differently. 

As I understand it Mac was always less snobbish than Iris regardless of background. And with the later storylines it wasn't clear to me whether Mac had come from a wealthy background or if he had married a woman whose family came from money and that it was her stepmother's influence that had brought Iris up the way she was.

For some reason I thought that Alfred was perhaps a professor, but I am not sure whether that is correct.  Adam and Neal definitely appeared to have no issues or conflicts or baggage related to class. Maybe around that time Reginald expressed some disdain for Michael's humble background as a stableboy but it wasn't really very meaningful in the scheme of things.

Adam and Neal were really just a blip between Jamies and weren't integrated well enough to last. It was nice that Adam attended Mac's funeral but then the waters closed over him as if he had never been. (I take that back -- maybe Adam rated a mention when the McKinnons dropped in to see Kathleen in 1991. But probably not after that.)

3 hours ago, AbcNbc247 said:

I also heard that mid 1987 was the point where there were no more missing episodes, and that the end of the Sin Stalker storyline was missing. 

I remember the suggestion that they couldn't start with the early 80s because they didn't have all the tapes, but the idea that they were missing tapes from as late as early 1987 is blowing my mind a little. I wonder what the retention and cataloguing system was like because it was certainly common to have flashbacks to earlier events in the early/mid 80s. Most of the time they were pretty recent events (within days), but sometimes they were further in the past than that and they must have had a system to locate the clip they wanted.

2 hours ago, AbcNbc247 said:

There was a rumor going around that since there was so much turnaround the year before, mid 1987 was the easiest time for fans to jump right in and have a good understanding of the show, characters, etc. 

Didn't they also want to start there because it was when Anne Heche began as Victoria?

On 4/6/2024 at 10:03 PM, DRW50 said:

I would have loved hearing Agnes' thoughts on AW in the early '80s...

I would have been interested in her thoughts on any time period -- although I have to admit that I never really watched AMC or OLTL and don't have a good sense of what they were like under Nixon. 

I have to find the link again but I was reading an article originally published in the early 1990s that alluded to Agnes Nixon's having created a character on AW who had been Miss Black-Eyed Pea of 1960. Surely that must have been Lahoma. 

I've been trying to get my head around Sam Lucas -- was he supposed to be significantly younger than Ada or was Lee older than the novelizations gave me the impression she was? 

1 minute ago, chrisml said:

What was the deal with Neal Cory? I had never heard of the character until recently. Was the character another missed opportunity?

Neal (played by Robert Lupone) was a kind of ambiguous character who did a lot of shady-seeming stuff related to the Egyptian treasure. In the end I believe it turned out he had been on the side of right all along but he was sort of isolated so it was hard to feel good about the twist.

He pursued Victoria (then played by Ellen Wheeler) -- sometimes in a way that seemed like it could be charming, but at least once in a way that seemed like attempted rape. Then suddenly one day he left as his handsomer, more obviously straight-arrow brother Adam came to town to work for the BCPD.

I don't know why they replaced Neal with Adam so it's possible that they could have transitioned him into Adam's role if they hadn't decided to burn Neal's bridges. 

I have been reading Agnes Nixon's book My Life to Live. Here she describes watching Another World when Irna Phillips suggested she take the head writer position after CBS passed on All My Children:

Quote

I was shocked by the slow-moving, lachrymose episodes, which almost put me to sleep. I realized that Another World's only hope was to change the plodding pace by adding comedy. Not pranks, but the type of human comedy that we all share. This occurred to me because there were several actors on the show with wonderful comedic talent: Doris Belack, Tony Ponzini, Ann Wedgeworth, Judith Barcroft, Robin Strasser, Constance Ford, and Jordan Charney.

On first reading it sounds as if the actors were already there and inspired her writing, but based on the dates I believe Nixon created all of their characters.

I also thought it interesting that she doesn't seem to mention Rachel at all, not even as a prototype for Erica Kane whom she discusses as if the character had no precedent in her work. 

Unlike Harding Lemay, Agnes Nixon was capable of delegating to subwriters while headwriting two shows.

30 minutes ago, Khan said:

This one hurts.  A lot.

Definitely. I loved his Floyd Robertson for his irascibilty.

Since we are on a soap site -- at about 23 minutes in here he is as Rocco pretending to be Violet Mckay's long lost son Billy.

2 hours ago, Khan said:

Except, I think Rachel was more vulnerable, because her father had abandoned her and Ada.  She did some terrible things when she was young, but you understood that she did them because, to her, achieving social status gave her the kind of security she had lacked while growing up.

According to Harding Lemay in his book Eight Years in Another World (take with as many grains of salt as necessary), Olive was brought to town in order to delay Alice and Ray's marriage because of the timing of the recast from Ted Shackelford to Gary Carpenter.

An obstacle had to be devised to keep them from the altar. That obstacle materialized in Olive Gordon, Ray’s estranged wife, who appeared unexpectedly to demand a large settlement before she would free him. Thwarted in that, she quickly moved into an alliance with Willis to prevent Ray from marrying the woman Willis wanted for himself. In Olive, the fans once again had a focus for undiluted hatred. No actress on the show had received such condemnatory mail since Robin Strasser’s days as Rachel, and Olive Gordon was developed as the instrument through which John Randolph was destroyed.

The more I read the more it feels like Olive was treated as a plot device rather than a fully-realized character. Maybe Jennifer Leak's performance added nuance that I am not grasping.

I was interested to note since we had discussed Liz' disappoinments in love that apparently she lost Charley to Ada. I have a hard time imagining Ada troubling herself to take an active part in a love triangle. 

There were lighter moments, more to my liking, as brash Burt courted vacillating Clarice, whose father Charley had moved in with her and her young son and soon the object of competition between Ada and Liz.

Joe Flaherty of SCTV has died.

https://www.tvinsider.com/1129950/joe-flaherty-dead-tributes-sctv-freaks-and-geeks/