GL95

The SORASing really breaks my brain when thinking about whether Blake/AM would’ve interacted as cousins, but it seems likely not? I do think it’s funny the show implies both Blake/AM maintaining a close relationship with Ed/being part of the larger Bauer clan in the early 90s when the Bauer were decimated but at the same time downplaying them growing up as part of the same family. But when Rick was gone they had to make AM/Blake like they were Ed’s kids to play up Ed as patriarch. Awhile back I watched the episode with AM being shot by Blake by accident, and they had to decide if the Brilliant Daniel St Jean would perform surgery. Ed called Hope who abdicated to Ed/Alex to decide which I found a bit amusing. (This was played up for drama very briefly but Alex deferred to Ed’s judgment though Ed pretty clearly didn’t want to decide knowing how that would go with Spauldings if things went wrong haha).

I think another fun bit of intrigue could be a non-romantic triangle between AM/Roger/Blake. She would start out ecstatic to be working with them and being integral to keeping things from imploding, but if AM starts to become the son Roger never had (since Hart never had any interest in business and was pretty consistent about it unlike Nick/Phillip) I could see Blake start scheming to keep her positioning with them both. Also if Bloss are together you have the spectre of AM always there plus I could see Roger trying to bring AM/Blake together. As I joked before this ends with Ross/AM fathered twins. We now have our stage set for the younger generation with the AM progeny being Roger’s favored grandson and Ross’s being the also ran in a flip of Phillip/AM’s roles in the Spaulding hierarchy. In 2005 when everyone is SORASed Lizzie is in a creepy but not true incest relationship with AM’s kid (but of course it initially starts because she’s working with Alan to lure AM’s son over to the Spauldings.)

If you don’t kill Maureen it also adds intrigue. Have her jump ship to Thorpe Enterprises when Vanessa goes back to Lewis Oil.

You probably need one Blake/AM slip up leading to a kid (a second twin perhaps haha) to tie Roger/AM if Blake/AM (or Blam haha) don’t reunite in this scenario so AM is at least the father of a Thorpe grandchild (which I feel like not having a Thorpe/Spaulding progeny was a wasted opportunity that was right there). So it’s funny I have seen the Gilly/AM scenes but through Lucy/Alan Michael clips on YouTube before I discovered full eps existed, but I had zero context about who Gilly was outside of working at WSPR. (I still am not up to whatever Roger’s betrayal of Gilly was in my viewing but feel like it’s coming soon with some hints.) One thing about Roger is for someone who plays the long game, he completely burns bridges for short term gains that cuts off potential allies. (Of course some of it is how Roger is really good at lying to himself and trying to use his truth to manipulate people-he keeps trying it with AM over making AM the patsy in the embezzlement scheme, trying to convince AM that he never had any intention of hurting AM etc.)

I was mostly joking about a Blake/Nick hookup but I do enjoy their scenes together. What’s funny knowing mostly what happens in the future with Nick is that AM basically accurately predicts everything that happens with Alex/Nick and the company outside of Nick ultimately bailing after getting the presidency. Yeah, I like AM/Blake’s dynamic at this point. They keep trying to manipulate the other but can’t really get one over on the other, but also ultimately get each other’s motivations. I don’t know if it’s because of Blake, but I like AM/Roger scenes and it’s interesting how Roger understands AM so much more than Alex does. I’m guessing it’s both Bloss taking off and Bev suddenly leaving, but I really do wish they’d tried out for a period AM jumping to Roger’s company like they’re strongly hinting at. (It could’ve been interesting even if you kept Bloss because it would’ve been insta-conflict for Ross if AM is part of the family business.) I also think AM/Holly have an interesting dynamic/ chemistry. Rick has such a different energy from Marj/RR and once Bev leaves I feel like AM actually fits in better with the Thorpe side of things.

Thanks! I definitely need the lesson. For some reason “Mindy’s mom” as a spouse of Billy’s made me chuckle.

I just saw another Hope name drop in 1992-AM when talking to Eleni about his insecurities about always being #2 mentions being second to the NY social scene with his mom. I know SS isn’t around much longer at this point but I like Nick best at this point when Blake is calling him out. They have an interesting chemistry-and really Blake needed to sleep with Nick to complete her run through the Spaulding men.

Yeah, I knew Ed and Hope were both alcoholics. That’s why it struck me when they had Ed say something to him about dealing with emotions through drinking. It felt pretty pointed to have Ed say it in a situation where AM didn’t actually get drunk. In this scene they really have him acting like an alcoholic. Roger comes to try to lay the groundwork to have him join the Thorpe empire (Roger thinks Blake still wants AM and AM/Blake as a power couple in the family kingdom fits Roger’s dream image really well) and AM has had a whole lot to drink but talks about handling it well and does have his wits about him more than he should. He lashes out at Eleni when he gets home in a way that feels like they’re planting seeds-some of it is pretty clearly that being raised to be a Spaulding left him with zero ability to be vulnerable or deal with emotions, but AM not getting hit with a combination of the Spaulding/Bauer curse really is a waste. An AM addiction plot could’ve brought in a lot of different characters. I can just see the rock bottom being lashing out at a very vulnerable Michelle post Maureen’s death, and Ed not having the bandwidth to help AM calls Hope. The Spaulding side trying to actually show love/help that’s not about business or internal power struggles and AM’s parade of exes who eventually all have a soft spot for him. The first iteration with Lucy ends with him getting wasted and saying cruel things to her (and he’s blackout drunk with her on a different occasion). Right after is when he goes back to wanting Eleni ( I believe getting very drunk when that starts), and the entire Eleni arc is more like an addiction arc than a love story on his end. There also would be an interesting backdrop for an addiction story at that time with Billy shooting Roger in a drunken rage. It really feels like it was heading that way when they pivoted-best reason I can think of is they saw a Nick/AM face off as a Hail Mary to make Nick catch on. Them making them foils who basically switch places was so uninteresting with no real investment in Nick and recasts of Alan/Alex and Mindy.

I’m in July 1992 when A-M is drinking himself into oblivion after he learns Nick is Alexandra’s son, and watching a lot of early 90s eps in close succession, I feel like they were setting the table for an A-M addiction story at some point. I can’t remember what triggered it, but in a different episode A-M swigs a drink in anger and Ed says something about that not helping. They have him pretty regularly cope with his emotions with booze and get really drunk several times. I could see the thought of planning Hope to come back for that then it getting scratched. I could see that last go round with Eleni while the terrible Jenna lotion story was happening being there instead since he’s spiraling at this point. Then them mentioning Hope in rehab not long after when he’s looking for Alan-an addiction story seems so much more interesting than the roaming the beach/unconscious at Tangie’s place arc. It’s funny because if they wanted Tangie in his arc she was a bar tender so it would’ve been easy. Watching the Eleni/Frank/A-M triangle for the first time, it's sort of wild that not only did they need to import someone for Frank D., they dragged on a triangle with an obvious conclusion that's just a slow walk of doom for A-M from the get-go (largely of his own making to be sure) because the only way to make Frank interesting even with Melina K was to put him a triangle that won't end. They had no idea what to do with Frank/Eleni with A-M not in the picture. They sort of have them as Ed and Maureen Lite, but then the Buzz of it all keeps that from really working for Frank (though Eleni is a random confidante for all kinds of people post recast since she has no internal life outside of catering post-recast). They also had Lucy doing absolutely nothing for months other than going on blind dates-Lucy being involved in helping him as a friend (maybe with Blake who would know the family history?) then Ed brings in Hope who learned a lot in that Swiss rehab. (I do think Hope as an alcoholic would give a bit of a natural excuse to make her seem older and explain how she seems closer in age to Alan.)

It’s a bit weird because they SORAS kids all the time where the original actor is still on the show or just ignore actors’ ages if they play older. Rick had two actresses around his age play up in years who worked closely with him in Toby’s Amanda and SS’s Blake (SS being 23 when she left the show blows my mind-even with Rick, SS’s Blake just seems so much older but ironically they started styling her younger late in her tenure I think to play up the Ross age gap). I feel like a late 30s actress with some gravitas could pretty easily pass as Rick/AM’s mom in soap world in the early 90s.

It’s always sort of crazy that the 20-something generation on the show at that point had parents who were so bad that Buzz raising Lucy as a homeless grifter always on the run is seen as the height of fraternal stability. Half the “fun” stories she tells are objectively horrifying, especially when you consider that Buzz is not uniting her with his other family mostly out of cowardice.

Lucy’s mom bailed at some point when Lucy was really young, so Lucy didn’t ever know her. Nadine pretty early on became something of a surrogate mom to Lucy. I for the first time have been watching the pre-ditzy diner owner version of Nadine and Nadine/Harley, and Nadine taking in Lucy pretty fast makes a bit more sense because she gets that ideal image of a mother/daughter relationship without all the baggage of an actual mother/daughter relationship. Though it’s funny when Nadine first sees a picture of Lucy before she comes to town, Buzz tells her it’s the daughter a of a war buddy he’d raised. Then when Lucy shows up, Nadine is actually pretty horrible to her telling her that Buzz has already done enough for her and he’s not her real father even if she thinks of him that way. Since at this point Nadine wants Buzz back, she changes her tune instantly when she finds out Lucy is Buzz’s biological daughter. They never show Lucy being particularly curious about her mom, though she and A-M are a bit of a matched set on not speaking about their moms. Watching starting in 1990 with how many times A-M is in peril and Hope never once coming is pretty wild. Exploring their relationship is such a lost opportunity because A-M’s dark side is always blamed on the Spaulding side of him, but being the son of a single mom alcoholic in and out of rehab likely contributed to that drive to be noticed/instinct to manipulate. Is it implied Mike was active in Hope’s offscreen life/A-M’s childhood?

They both were out alone and got drunk together the night Blake locked Amanda in the construction site trailer but snuck out then returned only to give herself hypothermia.

If you match that up with A-M being 18 in 1987 then A-M is only three years older than Lucy which makes no sense to the story. Soap math does make the head hurt. (It’s also objectively a hilarious thing to get fixated on when it comes to suspension of disbelief on soaps.) So, bottom line Lucy’s mom could be anyone as far as the timeline goes since the internal timeline makes no sense.

What’s funny is I had no idea until I came on this board that Amanda wasn’t supposed to be in her 30s when she was reintroduced given the backstory with Ross. I just assumed she was supposed to be older than Blake. Similar to Sherry Stringfield’s Blake Toby Poser’s Amanda played older to me. (Side note I was stunned to find out Rick Hearst is a year older than SS.)

Dylan’s supposed to older than Harley? It’s sort of crazy that Dylan is with high schoolers up through 1993 roughly.

Harley is also the only one who made a good choice in adoption agency as far as the adoptive parent situation goes. Dylan/Dinah both had terrible childhoods. Alex not remembering she had twins and Nick subsequently being sold by her ex might win on crazy retcons.

Harley should be roughly A-M’s age but that doesn’t really make sense with Buzz disappearing after he’s drafted if we’re talking A-M’s onscreen birthdate. The A-M SORAS really messes with any timeline of anyone on the canvas. A-M would be born around 1970 to match his 18 years old in 1987. Lucy was 20 in 1993 so if they tried to have their adult ages match up Buzz would’ve been with Lucy’s mom roughly 1976 if my (very rough) math is right.

I started my current viewing on Rick Hearst’s first day in June 1990 when A-M gets rescued from being kidnapped/tortured. I didn’t watch him getting scammed into the marriage but they have him come from this ordeal laying it on thick how the only thing that got him through the kidnapping was knowing the baby was coming. It’s a pretty horrible watch seeing her tell him she miscarried because we know he’s about to find out Phillip “died” as well. I think Blake/A-M after they divorce is a pretty great soap dynamic with two strong actors good at portraying characters whose wheels are always turning. A-M in a lot of ways is the monster of her own making. While he was definitely ambitious and out to prove something, a lot of his rush to grab power was Blake whispering in his ear and hitting all his insecurities. (She is very much her father’s daughter as played by SS.) She was the one who pushed hard to get back into his life when he wanted nothing to do with her, but then a lot of the confidence she instilled in him from successes that had a lot to do with her became arrogance. Then Blake calling immigration on Eleni led to the A-M/Eleni marriage. I liked the dynamic they set up even though it’s almost hard to watch, as Blake is scheming to break up A-M/Eleni but A-M knows full well Blake is working to prop him up because she is still in love with him. However, she’s also so closely hitched her own career prospects to him that if he cuts her loose and stops leading her on that she has nothing so there’s not much he can do to do right by her. What SS does so well is convey that she absolutely knows what is going on and it’s crushing, but she also is going to try to keep scheming until she wins just like Roger would. Until she decides an interlude to channel her pain towards hurting Holly is what she wants. I liked those scenes with A-M/Blake when they are just friends/confidantes who get each other (with some remaining sexual tension). I like those relationships like Ed/Holly being on the canvas that are always there and vaguely threatening to their respective partners, but also keeps the characters’ histories alive through their conversations.

Just how dead was Jackie? Buzz was dead on the show until 1993 haha. Phillip’s mom coming back from the dead AND being Lucy’s mom would be high drama at least. It reminds me of when they have Reva doing the police sketch of Brent as A-M and Alan dramatically watch. First, it’s sort of funny because while Reva was attacked by Frank Beaty’s Brent she remembers the face of the new actor. But then Alan and A-M spend a solid minute going back and forth saying “It couldn’t be” while Reva has no clue what they’re talking about, then them finally telling Reva the guy she drew was dead. No one in the room mentions that A-M would also have thought Reva was dead at the time she had the altercation with Brent. I really wanted Reva to say, “I should know just because you think someone’s dead doesn’t mean it’s true.”

What’s funny is I actually could see it still being a Sarah deathbed confession that she’s always known about this secret kid of Hawk’s. I actually like the Lanie Marler thought best just because Lucy and Phillip forming a familial bond that’s separate from A-M would be an interesting dynamic. It would also make Lucy Dinah’s cousin plus more organically put A-M/Blake into the same orbit to be confidantes again.

Lucy and A-M not having sex for a really long time even pre-Brent does make you feel like there were thoughts of an incest plot.

It just seemed like an interesting coincidence if they were really exploring Lucy’s parentage that Reva has an instant-sister a few months later and learns of it while still married to Buzz. Buzz grifting an older woman wouldn’t have been out of character at that point though giving Hawk a secret daughter wouldn’t have been at all unbelievable. It also has to be someone not actually on the canvas or Buzz would’ve known them. Roger having an unknown sister maybe? Maureen having had a secret child offscreen would’ve perhaps been an interesting twist especially since Matt was seemingly involved in every story at this point and pulled A-M more closely into the Bauer fold without incest. Lucy/Bridget being cousins would’ve resurrected that abandoned friendship that I liked. It’s not dramatic per se but ties Lucy to a lot of the canvas through Matt and the Lewises/Vanessa don’t like/trust A-M. Is there a viable Marler option? Lucy being related to Phillip and Ross would actually create the most drama for A-M I feel like. I know Sam’s too young and Jackie died too soon, right? Making her Annie’s sister would’ve been possible and have some dramatic possibilities at that time especially since Lucy likely didn’t learn about being so trusting post Marian/Brent haha

It really fits the history of the show if Ross was Blake’s Ed and A-M her Roger. (Granted I never watched any pre-RR Alan, but A-M always felt closer to Roger than Alan as far as his more treacherous acts/manipulations and his motivations for them.)

I was playing around looking at old soap opera press since I’ve gone down this early to mid 90s rabbit hole, and I read the SOD article before Lucy/A-M’s wedding and McTavish and Sonia Satra hint at the identity of Lucy’s mom being on the canvas. I actually wonder if Lucy was meant to be Reva’s sister but it got scrapped when Rick Hearst left and Lucy/Alan-Michael were just there to be part of Phillip’s revenge arc. The timing fits and it would’ve made the Alan/Reva conflict have more at stake than whatever iteration of Sixth Street gentrification. Though at that point if A-M/Lucy had a Spaulding/Bauer/Shayne/Cooper kid in the next generation it would be nearly impossible to avoid cousins haha