LondonScribe
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Apologies if this has been addressed previously, but who did they appoint as the new Series Producer?
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This 'feeding frenzy' (as it has been called) reminds me of the shooing Eastenders received when Loiuse Berridge was Executive Producer. The odd thing is that the show isn't in a swamp like it was in 2004 when it hit its nadir.
At this point, if the quality of refreshments at Elstree dipped it would be attributed to the state of the show. I'm not sure how many of you here are based in the UK but we have a tabloid press that I don't have much time for. This won't die down until a head rolls. Probably Bryan Kirkwood's, despite the fact it has been said no heads will roll. An early end to the story is not satisfactory in the eyes of many.
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6000 people complaining yes, but they appear to have the press backing them up or stirring it (at the very least).
I only question the stability of Bryan Kirkwood's postion because at the end of these contentious episodes, the very last name on the credits are his. Some will point and say he is responsible (even if this was being planned before he fully took over)...
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If Bryan Kirkwood is scapegoated and a replacement is sought, I wouldn't be surprised if the BBC employed from within. I'm talking about someone like Oliver Kent from Casualty or Craig Myar-Brown (sp) who has done a heck of a job with Holby City or even moving over Belinda Campbell (EP of both of the aforementioned shows)...
At the time of his appointment, I said he is a good storyteller and on that basis, he should do well. I also made reference to Eastenders being a machine. A machine that Hollyoaks wasn't. Is the machine chewing Kirkwood up? Possibly... Is he sinking in the deep waters 'muddied' by Diederick Santer (as has been suggested)? Possibly...
Or is this a storm that can be weathered before a 'brilliant summer'?
How odd that only 3 or 4 months ago, there was (arguable) stability in UK soaps. Now Bryan Kirkwood is Lucifer, Paul Marquess is gone, some people bemoan Phil Collinson and Emmerdale has to be careful behind the scenes given recent events. Amazing.
Lastly, John Yorke stepping in would always be welcome by a large number of people, but he has much greater BBC Drama responsibilities than 2000-2002, so how much could he do to help? And I'm someone who looks back on that period with great fondness.
Oh boy, too much talking again.
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Does anyone here think this reaction and media storm- however justified or not- could actually result in Bryan Kirkwood being sacrificed?
There has been talk of changing/reducing the story, but it appears as if the proverbial 'shedding of blood' will need to be achieved before people are satisfied...
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A suggestion coming from the DS boards (by way of linked tweets and articles) is that it was lung cancer...
But yes, 41 is no age.
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<b><u>AMC</u></b>
- Sounds like Marty Davich's piano cues: 0:57 - 2:15; 2:49 - 3:38; 5:54 - 6:38: <a href="
target="_blank">- Short clip from Babe's funeral (October 30, 2008): <a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gKLuloocP7M" target="_blank">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gKLuloocP7M</a>
<u><b>DAYS</b></u>
- Bo and Carly's theme I'm guessing (DAYS 1993). Composer - Marty Davich: From 2:43 - 4:14: <a href="
target="_blank">- Bo and Carly's theme again. (DAYS 1993). Composer - Marty Davich: From 3:35 - 5:15: <a href="
target="_blank">- Roman's theme (80's version). Composer - Marty Davich: From 3:10 - 6:58: <a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VbzSRk-nHss" target="_blank">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VbzSRk-nHss</a>
- Roman's theme (90's version). Composer - Marty Davich: From 6:28 - 8:25: <a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HQYYAvG1o0k" target="_blank">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HQYYAvG1o0k</a>
- Stefano's theme (80's). Composer - Marty Davich: From 2:57 - 4:17: <a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WpMtvulo1iU" target="_blank">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WpMtvulo1iU</a>
- Roman and Marlena's theme (80's). Composer - Marty Davich: From 7:00 - 7:37: <a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GsU_qHM7nec" target="_blank">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GsU_qHM7nec</a>
- Steve and Kayla's theme (80's). Composer - Marty Davich: From 1:47 - 3:27: <a href="
target="_blank"><b><u>GH</u></b>
- Stone's death theme (November 1995). Composer - Marty Davich: <a href="
target="_blank">- Stone's death theme. Composer - Marty Davich: From 3:30 - 6:40: <a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3dMbnx_puHI" target="_blank">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3dMbnx_puHI</a>
- Carly's theme. Composer - Marty Davich: <a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=idEQINTRXuc" target="_blank">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=idEQINTRXuc</a>
- Sonny and Brenda's theme. Composer - Marty Davich: From 1:30 - 2:10: <a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C3310QS3hBs" target="_blank">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C3310QS3hBs</a>
<u><b>Y&R</b></u>
- Victoria finds Gary's collage of photos (2000). Composers - Jack Allocco, Jez Davidson Guito, David Kurtz: <a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3Amdkqh7h3w" target="_blank">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3Amdkqh7h3w</a>
- Noah visits Cassie in the hospital (2003). Composers - Jack Allocco, Jez Davidson Guito, David Kurtz: <a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k0i890TUudA" target="_blank">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k0i890TUudA</a>
- Cassie's theme. Composers - Jack Allocco, Jez Davidson Guito, David Kurtz: From: 6:58 - 8:20: <a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NxLGFE3D774" target="_blank">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NxLGFE3D774</a>
- Adam sneeks into Victor's (October 13, 2008): <a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jb1k1Kivuxw" target="_blank">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jb1k1Kivuxw</a>
- Nikki/Victor flashbacks (October 14, 2008). Composers - Jack Allocco, Jez Davidson Guito, David Kurtz: <a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vYG0DaS-z0k" target="_blank">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vYG0DaS-z0k</a>
- Victor's theme (October 31, 2008). Composers - Jack Allocco, Jez Davidson Guito, David Kurtz: <a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j8Gi82vgRQY" target="_blank">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j8Gi82vgRQY</a>
- Victor and Ashley's theme (Nov 10th, 2008): <a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=daE3JhWEcfs" target="_blank">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=daE3JhWEcfs</a>
I once referred to this particular score as 'Michael's Theme' as he was often found to have this played over his scenes, particularly with Detective Webber in 2003.
Well, YouTube is our friend (and since the show and scenes weren't so frenetic) and the score is considerably longer. Starts at about 1:30.
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Thanks for your opinion! I think Kirkwood's time on the show was very uneven (2008 was just many missed opportunities and some questionable decisions, IMO), but I do see that he seemed to get the show more than a lot of producers. I agree with you that Marquess can't be held to the same standard.
I think my main annoyance is in the casting of certain roles and perhaps how panto some things seem. I haven't watched as much of the last few weeks though so I don't know how that's been.
So how do you feel about him re-doing the Diane Murray IVF story on Brookside?
Make no mistake, I am no Bryan Kirkwood fanboy, and I share some of your views on 2008 and no doubt some of the choices he will take on Eastenders. I just think he took a show that was rusting, restored it and painted it gold. (Lucy Allen then introduced what she thought was polish but turned out to be an erosive stripper).
As for the IVF story, I'm simply going to wait to see how it plays out. I could start caning it now and it could turn out to be the most though-provoking story this year. I could do the opposite and it could turn out to be absolute pony.
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I think the best way to answer the question is to compare it to going to a music festival and seeing a popular act on the main stage.
On occasion, one goes to the front and risks being battered in the mosh pit or being doused with stuff from the act on the stage.
I am the cautious so-and-so enjoying the act from a distance, close enough to see the act, facial expressions and all, but far enough to make a dash for it if it's not great or it starts raining.
In other words, I'm enjoying the show for what it is (and it's certainly not Pinter or Shakespeare) but the investment is not there. If it goes pear-shaped, it won't hurt me.
This is a show under Paul Marquess, the man who devised Footballers Wives, and turned The Bill from a police show to a show about models who happen to wear police uniforms.
This isn't a knock on Paul Marquess, who has his finger on some kind of pulse. And I'm not going to say I haven't enjoyed some of his work in the past but I haven't been expecting philosophical enlightenment or the answers to any of life's questions.
People have been somewhat spoiled by Bryan Kirkwood's stewardship of Hollyoaks, as his vision of the show was deeper and more complex than it was before or perhaps it ever will be again. If people expect that level of depth from the show under Paul Marquess then the disappointment will be palpable and possibly jading.
The majority of the praise for the show now comes from the 'Seth is fit' and 'Mitzeee is a hottie, check out that a***' brigade, so that is where we are.
Again, it's not a knock as it can be argued that the show has a 'typical' audience to service, and I can't speak for anyone else. In my view, the show is good to look at and it's colourful but I'm not going to just head first into a paddling pool. (At 6'1, that would be daft)...
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After all this (pointless, in my view) talk about the new credits, they arrive and the children on Digital Spy are not happy. Hilarious...
Anyway, I happened upon this old treasure from 2000.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NQilATEA2iE&feature=related
My favourite version of the theme.
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It feels odd only reading about the British Soaps and not being able to watch them. I'm currently in the States and it also feels odd with the roles being totally reversed and being able to watch the American soaps as they are shown.
By the sounds of it, Hollyoaks is starting to wobble again, as it finds its feet under Paul Marquess, which is disappointing. I guess I can form a comprehensive opinion when I get back to London.
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July 5th draws so much closer. With so many great stories coming up, i have a great feeling Hollyoaks is going to get a lot better.
I'll come back to you on that one on August 1st.... Or would September 1st be more appropriate? Two months may be a better indicator.
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Regarding the new titles, I think it will swing one of two ways. They will either be previewed/leaked before the end of the week (or shown with First Look on e4) or they will do what they did with the current style and wait until the 5 the the premier them. I remember they put the old credits over the Friday e4 episode to avoid 'leaks'
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There was going to be an alien story?
LOL UKLAW.....as for something memorable from the Lucy Allen era, the only thing that comes to mind is Warren's death (the mirror falling on top of him in the fire). Other than that, I can't think of anything else.
Ah, Toups, the mirror falling on Warren was actually the last Bryan Kirkwood credited episode (I believe). The episode that followed was the first episode Lucy Allan was credited with.
IIRC, Kirkwood had said in an interview that as long as he was in charge of Hollyoaks, Warren wouldn't pay for his crimes or die, as Warren was a character he had invested so much in. When Kirkwood, and then later Jamie Lomas, decided to leave, it was decided that Warren would leave with Kirkwood's end on the show.
I was willing to give Lucy Allan a chance, seeing as she worked so closely with Kirkwood, and helped put the 3 years together. But then concern started to
abound when reading her first interview (which I believe was Producer's Season 2009). The best way to
describe it is that there was a certain coldness and distance that came from the interview and the promise that the younger characters would be the focus.
The following few months, particularly with the promising but ultimately dull baby-selling storyline amongst others actually saw me withdraw from the show. An inspiration for my own writing it was not...
I've gone off on one again. Pardom me....
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Seeing as we are entering the final week of stories (seemingly) written by Lucy Allan, I thought it only fitting that we start to mention and recall the memorable stories, those plots and characters that really made you glad you invested your time, energy and emotions in Hollyoaks following on from the mostly successful period under Bryan Kirkwood........
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....... Anything?
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New opening credits too on July 5th!
He really let Allan's sh!t play out, as UK LAW predicted. Hollyoaks must have also been written SO FAR in advance, in comparison to other UK soaps. Bryan Kirkwood only started on EastEnders on March 1st officially, and we'll see his name in the credits there next Friday. Marquess started on Hollyoaks in early January and we'll have to wait until July 5th to see his name in the credits.
July 5th? Damn...
He clearly has the patience of a saint to wait until July 5th (true to form or not), but the question is, do we? Or will it be harder to compliment anything we see from now till then because we know it was sired by Lucy Allan, tweaks or otherwise....
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Yeah, right. Who are you kidding?
Watched first look e4 and it looks like it is the wedding week.
Lucy Allan is still credited, so I was wrong...
However, I have a sneaky suspicion she didn't produce it...
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Based on the fact that Lucy Allan's name remains on the credits suggests to me that Paul Marquess has stuck to type and kept clear of what he doesn't want to be associated with.
Reading between the lines (based on the little we have read), I am suggesting that Paul Marquess will be credited as Producer beginning the week of Calvin/Carmel's wedding.
Hey, I could be totally wrong...
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Information by not-so-tenuous link time:
The acting class my sister is attached to has just sent 3 of its pupils to Liverpool to (in the words of my sister) "audition for a new family. The only reason I didn't go is because I'm not 16 or over"
Plus, the 3 pupils are all black.
So, as I expected, it looks like this new family Paul Marquess is casting for is a direct replacement for the Valentines.
But, I don't think for a second that this will be the only new family. If the focus and dynamic is altered (as I expect Marquess to do) then I believe there will be at least one more family/unit.
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Can you blame them if it is so?
Who the h*ll is Lucy Allan?
At least Marquess proved himself a number of times...
I guess written humour is not my forte. I'll get it right.
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I'm going out on a limb here, but do you think Paul Marquess has been given all but TOTAL autonomy over the show's vision in a way Lucy Allan wasn't?
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I don't know if it's a recent thing, but Paul Marquess' nickname is The Axeman.
It's not a recent thing.
I wasn't a watcher of Brookside, but did watch Family Affairs and still do watch The Bill.
Both shows were rendered unrecognisable by Mr Marquess. To his credit, The Bill gained a new audience and became fashionable (in a different way). To this day, it struggles to shake the 'soap' tag (despite the best efforts of current Executive Producer Johnathan Young).
Family Affairs improved massively but had other problems (poor advertising, being on Channel 5, channel 5 being more interested in Australian soap, etc).
And Hollyoaks clearly needs an overhaul. This is only the beginning...
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Sean did meet an untimely demise on a New Years Eve (I forget which year) at the hands of a little thug called Liam. In turn, Tanya left Liam as he died of an asthma attack.
Blowing up the Harts on the boat was the work of former Coronation Street producer Brian Park, who oversaw the first revamp of the show back in late 1998/early 1999. The original premise of the show was the focus on the Harts. Brian Park saw this as an obstacle to the show's sucess so removed the Harts and relocated the show to west London.
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Thank you so much for adding your insights! I have not seen a lot of The Bill and have never seen Family Affairs -- why are there so few clips of that on Youtube? I can mostly only find the lesbian stories -- so you giving us more information is a big help. Why do you think all the revamps of Family Affairs never worked? Did he add any gay characters? I know they had some earlier on, although from the Wikipedia descriptions it sounds like most of them were killed or turned out to be bi.
Hollyoaks has already changed so much of its identity over the past few years anyway, and is now left a hollow shell, there's no real reason for him not to gut it. I just hope he will keep the better actors around. Like Jessica Fox. I can't stand Nancy, but Fox is a very strong actress.
Apparently someone on Twitter said that one of the crew congratulated Andy Moss (Rhys) on staying around, so I guess that either means he has signe a new contract, or Marquess decided not to fire him. I do think Rhys and Neville add to the show with the right stories. Suzanne is OK.
Family Affairs suffered mainly because it was on Channel 5. Even now (with its stability and decent quality programming) it still suffers from tha old stigma of being 'that cheap one with the dodgy porn and shitty docs'. Family Affairs was originally made by both (Talkback) Thames and Channel 5, whose Head of Drama was Corrine Hollingsworth (Former Eastenders and Eldorado producer). Thus she was listed as Exec Producer. Her Series Producer was Jane Harris. In the early years, that role was occupied by Mal Young (co-creator of the show who went on to be Head of Drama at the BBC).
When Channel 5 realised the show was suffering badly, they handed the production to (Talkback) Thames and their Head of Drama was Paul Marquess. He drafted in his own Series Producer and many of the writers and technical staff from The Bill (such as writer Steve Hughes and senior writer Catherine Cooke).
Another reason the show had problems was because it was on at 18:30- the exact same time as Hollyoaks, which had younger and more attractive actors. Now make no mistake, Hollyoaks was largely diabolical at the time, but all they had to do was put the character Natalie Osbourne (for example) on screen in a low cut top and that was it.
As for gay character, one of the first Marquess introduced was Sean Steele, who with best friend Tanya Woods became the Will and Grace (if you will) of Charnham. And he was paired with Brendan Boulter, who hid his sexual orientation (I believe he was bi) on account of his family and the fact he was black.
I'll not get carried away as this is the Hollyoaks thread, but Paul Marquess helped the show for a while. Gave it a new lease of life.....
Goodness me, I clearly have too much space in my head if I remembered all of that
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Family Affairs
in DTS: Foreign Soaps
Posted
It's actually Ken Farrington. Tom King from Emmerdale.
And don't get me started on Family Affairs. I'll not get any work done today.