DeliaIrisFan

2 hours ago, Donna L. Bridges said:

What you're talking about at GH is because of Frank, although I guess it started with Riche/Labine. 

There is a TV Guide mag article (April 2014) that Michael Logan did with Geary, Shriner & Jane Elliot that you would enjoy & get a lot out of. It's online & you should be able to find it. If you can't PM me & I'll get it for you. 

They talk about Frank & Ron saving the show & they talk about what people usually want to do with their vets contrasted with Frank & the vets. 

For sure, Valentini and Carlivati have an enthusiasm for veterans that is admirable, whatever else you could say about their work.  (And post-2009 at the absolute latest, there is little else good that I have to say.)  I just don't think any writer or producer would have been empowered to center so many characters in their 40s or 50s to such an extent for about 10-20 years there previously.  It seems like every regime had to pick and choose, and the vets who got airtime all had to be tied (by any dubious DNA test) to one or more of the teen characters.  Or they and/or their love interest were about to be killed off...

2 hours ago, Donna L. Bridges said:

I really don't know if Reilly would've felt that kind of collegiality, or either that he would've had concern for the state of the genre. 

So many people on so many shows did not have a sense of ... Well, they didn't seem politically aware of things going on with other soaps or the networks, etc. 

AW was the exception to that rule. 

My impression is that soap actors & PTB mostly kept their heads down. 

Reilly is probably a stretch, true - although to hear Nancy Curlee tell it, he did not play along with CBS/P&G's efforts to divide and conquer their writing partnership at GL.  And he did manage to get some of the best GL script writers to Passions (I'm not sure what they did there, based on the dialogue in every scene I ever saw).  It wouldn't have had to be a big public thing, but there were writers and producers with proven track records of delivering successful material and not taking any sh*t from the networks who were recently MIA at what turned out to be a critical juncture.

9 hours ago, Mona Kane Croft said:

It seems to me, based what's going on with the remaining television soap operas, that the shows have completely given up on attracting the youth demographic.  It seems they are seeking ratings in general without pursuing a particular age group. If they had made this decision 20 years ago, there might be several more soaps still on the networks.   Does does anyone else agree?  

8 hours ago, Donna L. Bridges said:

I do. I think that when the ad agencies sold their bill of goods that one demo was better than others, which I continue to believe was a crock, then the artificiality of the situation was not good for anyone. 

1 hour ago, vetsoapfan said:

This is an honest question and NOT in any way meant to come across as snarky.

What are the remaining soaps doing these days that indicate they are working towards improving their general ratings?

From my (admittedly limited) interest in today's soaps, I only see them making the same old mistakes over and over again.

And also, do you think that the way TPTB are handling the surviving soaps will do any good and actually help the anemic ratings increase?

Again, no snark intended.

There was something I noticed when I tuned back into GH after many years for Jackie Zeman's send-off last month.  This is a slight exaggeration and certainly not scientific at all, but it seemed to me like there are more Gen X breakout soap stars of their day featured prominently on that one show than there were Baby Boomers on the frontburner across all the soaps in the late '90s/early '00s, who would have been around the same age then.  To say nothing of even older cast members.  It seems like those actors are there now because someone thinks they'll appeal to lapsed soap viewers, even if those viewers are older now.

Of course, many of those middle-aged+ performers who are now getting work on GH made their names on shows that are off the air (like Maura West, to bring it back to ATWT) and/or in stories that were mostly lackluster to begin with.  And whether they're being well utilized is even further off-topic, so I'll just leave it there on that note.  It's just sad this couldn't have happened when there were still ~ 10 soaps with 40+ and 50+ year-old veterans who had rich histories that could still be mined - ATWT chief among them, of course.

That said, I don't know if the all-powerful demographic has actually been debunked or if networks have given up on the idea of 18-34 year–olds watching a soap, or perhaps any other network TV in the daytime.  Still, knowing what I know now, a part of me wishes TPTB had decided in 1990-something that soaps were on borrowed time and let them keep doing their thing for as long as it continued to make sense to keep them on the air.

1 hour ago, Donna L. Bridges said:

Given the NBC mindset about Reilly, who they thought was a miracle-worker, they very likely did not micromanage him, content to just watch whatever outrageousness he might come up with next. Now, eventually he didn't get his way. He wanted those 10 characters to be dead-dead. And, not that I like giving him credit, but Corday made him do Melaswen Island & bring them all back to life. For once Corday asserted himself & was correct. 

 

Exactly - whatever creative freedom Reilly enjoyed at that time, he might have seen the writing on the wall and spoken up if he had seen multiple writers he knew and respected being steamrolled by the suits. 

So many showrunners in place at that time seemingly were in over their heads.  It's hard not to think some others just didn't care.  You might say the networks stepping in was justifiable, at least until they rehired writers and producers who had proven histories and apparently treated them the same way.

56 minutes ago, Donna L. Bridges said:

Bill Bell was totally free of network meddling. Only he had it, but he had it in spades. And, once he was gone, Y&R didn't even have a grace period. They began micromanaging IMMEDIATELY. 

Who are you thinking of, strong, who was not on the scene now?

 

Most notably, Doug Marland had died the year before, so ATWT was both struggling creatively and written by people with little to no experience standing up to networks.  Nancy Curlee had just left GL, and Robert Calhoun a couple of years before that.  Agnes Nixon was allegedly sidelined at AMC during Megan McTavish's tenure (wasn't MM the first person besides Nixon to be credited at the top of AMC's writers?) so probably less inclined to do battle with ABC.  And, controversial or not, didn't Linda Gottlieb also leave OLTL that year (although that might have been an effect as opposed to a cause of the changing power dynamics)?  Of course, others going back to Irna Phillips had been long gone.

ETA: SB had been canceled the year before, so—also controversial—Pam Long and the Dobsons were not working in the industry for the first time in over a decade and several decades, respectively.

I just wonder what would have happened if a few more of these veteran showrunners had been around to present a united front with peers like Labine, and Bell, even if he was less personally affected.  Even Reilly, with his newfound clout, by all accounts did not like being micromanaged.  But he was probably just doing his own thing and to some extent oblivious to what generic writers at lower-rated shows were dealing with.

IMO the OJ trial happening when it did, as opposed to the timing of Iran-Contra, etc., made for kind of a perfect storm for soaps.  In hindsight, a number of formidable writers/producers with strong points of view were recently gone from the industry or stepping back.  Many of the shows weren't offering up their strongest material to begin with, and nearly all of the showrunners were less experienced than some of their recent predecessors at successfully standing up to the networks to protect their vision (to the extent they had one).  For my money, GH was the only soap that was at the top of its game by June of 1994, and Claire Labine has said managing the networks was something she wasn't the best at.  But she and Bill Bell (who was probably more insulated from network meddling) had decades' more experience as head writers than just about anyone else working.

I also suspect Reilly's DAYS benefited from being, unintentionally at least at first, counter-programming.  On the increasingly rare day when even 15 minutes of a soap aired, the possession story was different from anything in the wall-to-wall OJ coverage.  Of course, by the time the ABC/P&G shows started getting mandates to copy it, the trial was no longer offering up sensationalized drama that was at least related to real-life issues, which had been kind of the bare minimum you could expect from most soaps up until that point.

And the drop in ratings across the board seemed to feed into a self-fulfilling prophecy.  Network execs doubled down on their micromanaging, which had already probably weakened some of the lower-rated shows, because now almost every show's ratings constituted a crisis.  At least, it did in their minds, although the fact that any shows are still on the air 30 years later—all with much lower ratings—casts doubt on the idea that most/all soaps weren't still turning a healthy profit back then.

On 2/8/2024 at 1:23 AM, DRW50 said:

Some mid/late '90s episodes uploaded here just now.

VintageNoSpintage - YouTube

The May 1995 episode is a great find from the Labine era.  I've seen that mob shooting montage itself—which, unlike any number throughout the late '90s and '00s, involved characters who were genuinely trying to extricate themselves from that kind of life of violence, and the emotion was earned—a number of times over the years.  But I'm not sure the full episode has seen the light of day in almost 30 years. 

Although the shooting happened at night, the show opened with everyone waking up/eating breakfast, and various characters dropped in briefly throughout the day without necessarily appearing in all or most of the acts: Lucy only showed up mid-episode/midday for an ELQ board meeting (that was indirectly related to the mob war), early Emily talked about A Wrinkle in Time and her other favorite books, and Bobbie was in just one scene: doing a good deed for Emily's dying mother, Paige, out of friendship to Monica.  In fact, there were a number of fairly extended scenes between friends: Monica/Paige, Mac/Felicia (who were broken up at this point and years away from a reconciliation), and Brenda/Robin. 

This episode also featured the full end credits, including non-contract players.  Some soap marginalia: Larry Lau, presumably the same actor who had played Greg on AMC, was credited as a coroner (I'm at a loss as to what story at this time that would have involved).  Also, "Sonny's guy" was played by Mike Sabitino.  My guess is this wasn't the '90s soap hopper Michael Sabatino (and Crystal Chappell's husband), who probably would have merited a character with a name at that point in his daytime career, but I can't find any actor on IMDB who spelled their name that way.  Most likely this was the Mike Sabatino with a number of '90s credits, including that summer's (in)famous Batman Forever.

18 minutes ago, Vee said:

That was nuts and seemed like a Sonny/Lois chemistry test to me, as I noted to caroline at the time.

Ah.  Maybe.  But they always had chemistry, it's just that Lois knows (or knew) better.

Actually, has Lois had any substantive scenes with Michael?  It just occurred to me that Sonny's adopted son and a Quartermaine heir running ELQ might seem to Lois like an unholy alliance between two forces she was always ambivalent about.  It would make more sense if Lois had told Sonny about Nina because she wanted to thwart whatever Michael was up to in keeping that secret, to make sure her daughter didn't get caught up in it.

3 minutes ago, carolineg said:

Like I was saying my understanding is L&B still exists but Lois gave up on it years ago when Brenda bought it from her in 1998? and it's just been around with different owners since then.  She manages bands now which seems more lucrative and easier with the changing demands of the industry.  It also makes sense since that's where she started.  Clearly she's not super busy if she has months she can just hang out in Port Charles though lol.

Oh, sorry, I thought you meant Lois's current involvement in the music business was through L&B.  I guess that makes sense for the character.

14 minutes ago, carolineg said:

When Olivia said Lois wanted Sonny's approval the other day I was like.....what?  That's now how Lois and Sonny's friendship worked at all.  

The scene circa New Year's Day when Lois was egging Sonny on not to "forgive" CW's character was the most bizarre I've seen.  Unless Lois has some history with Nina that went completely over my head, if Lois even cared one way or the other, she should have reminded Sonny how things turned out the last time he exiled a woman who "betrayed" him and asked him how many more chances he thinks he's going to get.

I don't even know how the music industry works these days, but I just assumed Apple, Amazon, et al, make most of the money BTS.  In any event, I can only imagine the '90s would have turned out to be a lousy time to be founding a startup record company, even one that had signed the fictionalized version of Ricky Martin.  I think it would be more interesting if Lois's company hadn't made it for real-world reasons, and that was still a sore spot for her, but she had nevertheless been able to parlay that experience into some industry that one or more other characters work in currently.

55 minutes ago, carolineg said:

Well, it seems like a return no one had any plans for lol, but that does make sense.

I think Brook Lynn has mentioned more than once Lois was overbearing.  And Lesli kay's short lived version of Lois was.  It's not completely out of left field, but it still feels a bit out of character for Rena's Lois.  Since Brook's entire childhood was basically off screen it's hard to say.

Yeah, I remember Lois being at the wedding, but she didn't actually know Jagger except through Brenda.  I can't think of any real one on one scenes with RS and ASJ.  Possibly there was a scene at Kelly's when Jagger and Karen came back briefly when Stone was ill.  I think Karen/Jagger spoke to Ned/Lois for a minute.  So I would say Lois would know who Jagger is but only in an acquaintance sense.

LLC never shared scenes with any Lois.  Olivia did state she and Lois were friends when she first came to town though.  I don't think Olivia ever said they were bffs or anything like that though.

It seems like the first 35-40 years of Olivia's life—from what I remember reading online at the time she and Dante were introduced, and the exposition/recap she helpfully provided in the New Year's Eve episode—might have turned out differently if she had a BFF like OG Lois.  When Olivia screamed at Lois that Sonny shooting Dante was the worst moment of her life, I had a flash of something Lois once said to Brenda: "Are you going to stand by your man until he bleeds to death like some stupid country western singer?"

Agreed that Lois barely knows Jagger, if at all.  It makes sense they might have met when Stone was dying,but given Brenda's role as Ned's accomplice in his double life at the time of the wedding, she wouldn't have brought Lois to the wedding if she thought Lois would know anybody there, let alone the groom.

I also agree Lois would not be so overbearing, or at least if she were she would be trying to overcompensate for the Quartermaines' influence, not goading Tracy to spend yet more money on Brook Lynn's wedding. 

Even if the idea is that Lois has turned into her parents, which is maybe getting lost in translation because Rena has barely aged, Lois's mother was OK with the fact that Lois had eloped to a justice of the peace (with "Eddie").  I also can't believe Lois had so much more tact in her 20s than she does at this point in her life (Edward genuinely respected her business savvy, and now she's getting into screaming matches in people's places of business?).  And Lois was never blindly loyal to Sonny.

52 minutes ago, Vee said:

Extremely common for this show tbh.

I can only hope PM finds real plans for Rena, who I'm sure he wrote for at B&B a fair bit.

I was wondering that.  In the grand scheme of things, the writing for Lois isn't even in the top 20 list of what this regime needs to try and fix, but her return was one of the few pleasant surprises when I tuned back in this year for Bobbie's memorial.  (I already knew Lucy, Tracy, et al were featured semi regularly and looked amazing, but I also knew they were mostly rehashing scenes from the '80s and '90s.  Whereas Lois at this point is almost a blank slate.)  I'd selfishly love to see something good for her character.

42 minutes ago, j swift said:

For me, Lois requires a great deal of suspension of disbelief.  For example, last week, her main story was that she was over involved in Brook Lyn's (one L or 2?) wedding planning.  Causing BLQ to complain about how Lois is so overbearing.  Meanwhile, for the past few years we've seen Brook involved in a baby switch and numerous other big life events and Lois was nowhere to be found.  So, they're telling us that she is a helicopter Mom, but we've never seen evidence of this until the past few months. 

Whoa.  Yeah, when I tuned back in for Bobbie's memorial and recognized the actress playing Brook Lynn from (Valentini's) OLTL, I figured she would have plenty to do, and plenty for Lois to support at least.  But the wedding-planning scene (with Tracy being the de facto Lila) was just bizarre.

I think JE and RS are good together, even if the writing for their scenes is as superficial as they were in 1996.  Have they even established what Lois now does for a living?  Presumably her record company would have either made the transition to digital and she's so independently wealthy that she wouldn't need the Quartermaines' hospitality, or more likely she transitioned to another business but probably gained some impressive experience along the way.  Couldn't she have some kind of business dealing with Tracy that adds some layers?

44 minutes ago, Liberty City said:

I feel like the re-introduction of Lois was all the strike team.. and not something Van Etten & O'Connor were ever planning.

That makes sense.  From the clips I could find of Ned's amnesia by the time I realized Rena was back, it seemed like a stupid story, but at least it made sense for Lois to be there.

Then again, there are so many prominent (GH and/or other) soap stars from the '90s on cast, with varying degrees of airtime.

33 minutes ago, carolineg said:

The way the show is utilizing Lois is odd.  She doesn't really do a whole lot and it is disappointing.  She hasn't been integrated with the cast at all really.  Lois spends a lot of time with Olivia.   Lois just really doesn't fit in with the any stories right unless they push her towards Sonny, which I don't think anyone would really want.   I know Rena was available and the show jumped on that, but it doesn't feel like there was an actual plan for Lois besides sparring with Tracy, gossiping with Olivia, and planning Brook Lynn's wedding.  Lois deserves better.

For all I know they could be planning to pair Lois/Jagger lol.  I don't think they even know one another that well, but I think they may have a few scenes back in the day.

I remember Lois was at Karen and Jagger's wedding, as Brenda's plus one.  Incidentally, that may have been the last time Lois spent the night in the Quartermaine mansion itself before she moved in(?) a few months ago (one of many things I don't think rings true about how Lois is being written).  I remember Brenda was living there at the time and invited Lois to stay over.  I believe that was the first time Lois (knowingly) met any of the Qs, besides Ned.

Did LLC share scenes with (any) Lois previously?  Was it even stated explicitly when Olivia was first introduced that she and Lois had been childhood friends, or was that a retcon?  It's hard to believe anyone would have cared enough to make that connection back then.

Every time ASJ says or does something that gets C-list media attention, I'm more ashamed that my adolescent self lusted after him in various states of undress.  Beyond that, I could care less about him, let alone the character.

Meanwhile, I've been keeping my eyes out for Lois's name in the episode summaries on Hulu ever since Bobbie's sendoff (which was the first I'd learned Rena Sofer had returned).  I was beginning to think Lois had been written off without explanation, but apparently she'd been wandering around the Quartermaine mansion off-screen for about a month.  This Jagger recast makes me question if the intention for all the living characters who were on the show in 1993 to join her?

I love seeing Rena as Lois, but I don't love how they're writing the character.  I'm also at a loss as to where she fits into the "main" stories.  Ostensibly Lois is playing a supportive role in her daughter's story, but Brook Lynn seems to be backburnered herself now.  Lois's most dramatic material in the past month with the Olivia character, who disappeared herself for most of January.  And of course Ned remains MIA altogether.  Am I missing something?

All to say, the way they're wasting Rena's Lois doesn't bode well for bringing back another character from that era with fewer connections to the current canvas and a recast.  Never mind, of course, that there is a new writing team taking over in a month...why on earth recast Jagger now?

7 minutes ago, Toups said:

And yeah, it will be interesting to see if Mulcahey and Korte will be allowed to bring in some of their people as part of their staff. 

Is the current GH writing team still primarily composed of Carlivati's OLTL hires, or have most of those followed him to DOOL?  I can't remember the OLTL names at this point, but Korte's name was the only one I recognized from GH BITD the week of Bobbie's death.

6 minutes ago, Vee said:

Would not shock me if she jumped.

I meant as part of the head writing team, but if I read she was back onboard in just about any capacity I'd be even more interested than I already am.

1 hour ago, robbwolff said:

I'm thrilled to see a woman back as a head writer. It's been nearly 5 years since a woman has been head writer of a soap.

WOW...

I didn't realize Korte was disliked online.  I didn't even realize she was still at GH until I tuned in for Bobbie's memorial and spotted her name in the credits.  I just assumed she had left with all the other writers who worked with the Labines back in the '90s.  I too had goodwill toward her based on that history.

Mulcahey's experience as one of the revolving doors of co–head writers at GL gives me pause, but agreed there were other factors.  Of course, some of those factors seemingly apply to GH 30 years later.  It is curious that GH offered and he agreed.  In fact, it's been so long since any "big name" hire behind the scenes at a soap, probably because there are so few left from the genre's golden/silver eras.

I wonder to what extent the issues that reportedly drove most all talented head writers out of the genre in the late '90s and '00s are still in play.  I can't imagine any networks' daytime divisions are still top-heavy enough for the execs to micromanage the way they seemed to be doing a quarter century ago.  And the remaining soaps take so much time hiring or firing any of the last producers/writers left standing (if the dates in this article are correct, Van Etten's been head writer at GH for almost as long as Doug Marland was at ATWT) that I can't imagine the suits are frantically chasing something new every other week to try get the ratings/demos back up to some unachievable pre-modern level.  That's probably because the networks have given up all hope, which is no cause for celebration, but maybe that leaves a little room for someone with talent and vision to do something good for however much time they have left.

All that is to say, this is genuinely exciting news to me.  And I was just thinking during the Bobbie episodes how many great characters (and/or their grown children) are still viable.  I'll have to keep an eye on this show, for the first time in decades.  Although if GH is trying to get the band back together again, I think Michele Val Jean should have gotten an offer (is she still at B&B?).

Meanwhile, the reference to Monica having a scene with Lois a few pages back was the first I learned that Rena Sofer was back. lol 

I never thought I'd see that.  I went back and watched Lois's scenes from the full episodes that are still available in my Hulu account and Rena is great.  But I am grateful for the explanation of the whole SEC story in the first pages of this thread, because the way these characters were going on about it was really WTF.  The one thing I'm still wondering is why Lois cares about any of this, least of all who "ratted out" Sonny's ex and Cameron Mathison's character?  Unless she's worried about Brooke Lynn's involvement in Michael and Ned's deal or something? 

If anything, I could see Lois calling the SEC herself on principle, and then all these people who are mad at Cynthia Watros's character turning on Lois for that.  Or maybe Sonny overhearing Lois questioning her daughter about why everyone is so mad about reporting a crime and learning the truth that way.  Lois may be obsessed with the truth, but not with truth tellers.  She was the one who convinced Brenda to wear that wire on Sonny all those years ago, and she exposed Ned's bigamy in front of the whole town and let the chips fall where they may.

1 hour ago, Vee said:

If you can accept it as a substitute for onscreen intimacy or any other character building, then sure. Golden Girls and other gay pop culture TV cliches were the language the GH gays spoke in during that era.

Ah.  No, that's not okay.

I too thought Hogestyn was fine, from what I remember of Lucas at that time.  It's more that I just couldn't really picture him after all these years, and I didn't feel like his character was the focus of the story (not his fault).

I don't think I realized Carnes lasted as long as he did last time, or that they recast right after he left.  I probably don't want to Google what Carnes had to say about COVID?

I may have assumed Lucas's return a decade ago was headed in a particular direction based on the aforementioned things that creative team had done with LGBTQ+ characters at OLTL.  Also, by that point, I could only take their material overall in small doses.  I liked Felix okay when he first came on (Lucy's first scene back was with him, right?  I think that's what I first tuned back in for) even if the actor was green.  Now that I think about it, I do remember the Sabrina character and the lead-up to Robin's return.  I must have tuned out by the time most of what was described of Felix's involvement in their triangle with Patrick played out, because it sounds awful but I have no recollection.

When I heard Lucas was back a year or so(?) later and started watching his scenes, I didn't mind the idea of pairing him with Felix.  They (and Brad) just didn't seem to be getting much airtime.  Especially not in comparison to what I assumed a cishet triangle centered around a character who had just learned their long-lost mob kingpin father was alive would have gotten.  Maybe it was just a dry spell, because it sounds like they got more material than I anticipated.  Alas, descriptions like "Carnes even played Phil Brewer in the flashback sequence in Luke's big psychodrama episode" and "try to force Michael to have sex with him" don't make me feel like I missed anything...  (Now, the premise that Lucas likes to watch Golden Girls reruns I could get behind.)

FWIW I thought Lucas's scene with Felix at the funeral was well-handled and seemed about the right length given the occasion and how I assume their relationship ended.

16 hours ago, DRW50 said:

I can only echo what others have said about Ryan Carnes. Carnes was not actually there for most of the important moments in Bobbie's history, but you still felt the weight of his performance. Considering how close Lucas and BJ were, I'm glad, if pleasantly surprised, they gave that final moment to him, instead of Carly. 

That's a really good point.  In fact, wasn't Drake Hogestyn's son even playing Lucas during the coming-out "story"?  Agreed, you wouldn't know that watching this past week.

I too want to echo all of the praise for Ryan Carnes's Lucas, and share some personal reflections on this character.  Now seems as good a time as any, when realistically we may not see the character ever again.  I was actually a little surprised at how meaningful Lucas's scenes were for me this week.  I think I've checked out GH for almost every incarnation of Lucas in the past ~20 years, and always promptly checked out soon enough for the reasons others have discussed above.

A big part of the affinity is personal for me, because the character and I have had a few things in common.  Lucas came out not long after I did, in the grand scheme of things.  However, it was a few years later, by which point I was definitely an adult—and, frankly, I had enough distance from the genre in its then state—so I had some perspective.  I wanted to tune in but didn't have high expectations, and I was disappointed but not too surprised with how the show (mis)handled most of it: from Bobbie's initial reaction and then how quickly that was resolved, to the lack of any real exploration of Lucas's sexuality, to say nothing of how I heard they had killed off Tony a few months later as part of the "climax."  Ultimately, though, I just turned the TV off again and hoped someday GH would revisit Lucas's character and do a good job.  I'm still hoping for that last part, but agreed it's unlikely at this point.

I also personally appreciated that Lucas's type 1 diabetes—something else I have in common with the character—has been referenced at appropriate points as (just another) part of who he is since childhood.  And the show has generally treated diabetes realistically, for at least 30 years on and off that I've seen (I have not seen his original diagnosis as a baby). 

Then this week brought a really random and momentarily disorienting coincidence for me: Bobbie's (retroactive?) birthdate listed on the placard outside of the funeral happened to be the same as my own mother's, who has been having some health problems recently.  I think they cut to Lucas's return immediately after that shot of the sign, or at least it felt to me like they did.  I almost lost it right then. 

All to say, I have long related to Lucas (or at least tried to) for various reasons, but seeing the reactions from others makes me realize it's not just me projecting.  I think this speaks to how powerful legacy characters can still be, even when soaps seemingly do everything they can to sabotage them.

In a parallel universe where those in charge of soaps were willing to try slightly more modern takes on what has worked best throughout the history of the form, Dr. Lucas Jones would have been a frontburner character for decades.  He should have had multiple love interests that were important plot- and/or character-wise, with at least one long-game soulmate who was also a core character and had his own sexual/romantic detours in that time (Dr. Tom Hardy, Jr., perhaps)?  And Lucas deserved a rich, on-screen adult relationship with Bobbie and Tony over the years, who in turn deserved age-appropriate, perhaps at times supporting but still substantive material of their own throughout that time.

Even in this world, it's not too difficult for me to tilt my eyes a little and see some of that in the collection of crumbs GH threw over the years, especially because Carnes is so good at filling in the blanks in the script.

37 minutes ago, Vee said:

I don't know if you were privy to all this so my apologies, but Leslie had a fall or something in early 2022 IIRC. She was supposed to be back onscreen within months (Leslie/Monica has appeared fairly often in recent years) but a year later she was still MIA. Finally they had Leslie do a voice cameo on the phone with Elizabeth for Epiphany's memorial last spring. Then about a month ago she appeared onscreen briefly in the scenes surrounding Finn's medical malpractice situation. She looked very frail to me, but the show promoted it, knowing fans had been worried. I'm still very concerned, as are we all.

Wow.  I must have missed that news a couple of years back.  Thanks for filling me in.  Sending good vibes, etc. for Leslie.

39 minutes ago, janea4old said:

Willow gave the explanation about Monica. She's married to Michael. They live with the Quartermaines.

Lesley Charleson has some health issues but that hasn't been specifically disclosed.  She appears rarely. Usually Monica is said to be "away at a medical conference" or "in the other room".

I am concerned and wish her well.

15 minutes ago, Khan said:

I wish her well, too.  We have lost so many wonderful people from this industry lately.  It feels like soap operas are just vanishing before our very eyes.

Oh, dear.  I wish Leslie well, too.

I vaguely remember Willow from some scenes earlier in the week, but I fast-forwarded when the conversation veered from Bobbie and didn't recognize the actresss without hospital scrubs.  I gathered she was married to Bobbie's grandson, but I assumed Michael must be long-gone and Carly had another son with AJ or Jason, based on his personality.  Michael lives with the Quartermaines now - progress?