RestlessDuncan

23 hours ago, kalbir said:

The Italian Y&R episodes kept the original background music. From what I've seen of Italian B&B, the background music was changed.

It was changed in 1987-1992 episodes. Then they started to keep the original background music. 

21 hours ago, kalbir said:

 

So Italy skipped most of 1986, all of 1987 and 1988, most of 1989, all of 1994 through 1997, and most of 1998? You were spared the focus on Cricket in the late 1980s, the focus on Nick/Sharon in the mid-1990s, and that lull period of Fall 1996 through the first half of 1997, but you missed a few good storylines as well.

It was crazy. In march 1991 and in march 1999 (when the time jumps happened) the tv channel aired two 40 minutes recaps that covered the missing years. The tv specials were produced and edited by Sony only for the italian audience. The first time jump shocked the viewers (Y&R lost 1/3 of its audience in a short time). Suddendly there were brand new characters and storylines, a new Jill (Jess Walton), a new Jack (Peter Bergman), a new Ashley (Brenda Epperson) and two Katherine (the real one and her look alike Marge). 

Here are two italian Y&R promos:

On Saturday, July 29, 2017 at 7:49 PM, kalbir said:

 

 

What was the last storyline that aired before cancellation? If the ending was 2005 or earlier episodes, then you were spared LML, MAB, JFP, Pratt.

 

Maybe it's me but I always got the impression that B&B is a bigger draw in most of Europe than Y&R.

In Italy Y&R had diehard fans, but it was treated so badly by Mediaset (the groups of channels that aired the show). 

From 1983 to 2009 they were shown: US Episodes from autumn 1979 to march 1986; from november 1989 to december 1993; from november 1998 to january 2007. In the summer of 1987 it briefly aired in primetime.

Yup. Heather Tom walked on her own. Based on quasi- interviews with Tom and David Shaughnessy back then it was pretty clear that they wanted to backburn Victoria in favor of Nick Newman. If you go back and read her storylines in her final year, it was clear she was in as sinking ship. TPTB wanted to make Nick and Sharon the new Nikki and Victor. Victoria went from being groomed as Victor 2.0 into being pushed aside for her brother who all of a sudden was corporate hungry (which he never was).

Shaughnessy also made it no secret that he wanted Victoria to be "softer" and closer to Nikki which changed the entire dynamic of the Newman clan. They were making drastic changing to the character of Victoria Nicole Newman and Heather Tom disagreed with majority of them. So in the end she walking. I know when it was announced they were recasting that they only planned on the character to be gone for a few months. It turned into almost 2 years. And I know during that time Tom expressed interest in returning, but I think bad blood at the time prevented it. It ended up being the best for Tom in the long run. I can't even picture her in this version of Victoria anymore to be honest.

Victoria in the 90s was a very well written character. She was definitely Victor's daughter: strong-willed, independent and she was not afraid to speak her mind. She had also a vulnerable side (like 'Christian Miller') and that made her a complex character in all her relantioships. Heather Tom was (and still is) so talented: her Victoria was a leader, a Victor 2.0.

I can understand why she left Y&R in 2003. The essence of her character had changed. Victoria was marginalized as business woman and her latest love interests weren't that great. Rafael was a b-storyline and the pairing with Diego was more focused on the Nick-Sharon-Diego triangle than on Victoria & Diego's feelings for each other. There were also long periods of no storyline at all for Vicky.

I believe in Heather Tom's last months on the show producers and writers tried to revamp Victoria, giving her more space, a new house, a flirt with Damon Porter and the pairing with Michael Baldwin. I liked HT and CLB together, they started to have such a good chemistry (but I love Michael & Lauren). Victoria and Michael, both so smart and unique. Unfortunately Heather left the show soon after and the pairing was stopped. In 2005, when Vicky'AH come back to GC, visited Michael and found out that Lauren was his new love interest.

I did like Brittany for the longest while. She was interesting and fun, the female version of J.T. and the anti-Mac. But I did not like that she and Raul broke up over Bobby. I was pretty much done with her when she got that scar which made her sappy and needy. Watching J.T. and everyone rally around her was pathetic. I thought that she was tougher than that. The writers were also clearly using the scar to make her into this young heroine which was unnecessary. When J.T. started to have feelings Brittany, it was over for me. I didn't like J.T. developing romantic feelings for her or Mac. I would have preferred that he had a romance with someone completely new.

I understand your point of view:) I started to consider Brittany too needy in 2005 episodes, when she kept asking for protection. J.T., the Newmans, Kay and Jill became her bodyguards because she was or felt always in danger. But I liked her last episode. Her exit was so Gone with the Wind: she had failed to win J.T. back (like Scarlett with Rhett, even if love wasn't gone between them) but she left GC with the 'Tomorrow is another day' look in her eyes. The scar storyline was good to show her vulnerable side, but she was still a strong character. She refused to give up her dreams. J.T. and Mac were boring as hell. She ruined him as a character.

Brad Bell did a pretty good job at B&B.

I absolutely agree with you:) He promptly corrected LML's mistake (I think it was his first move to make clear he didn't like how she was writing Y&R) and revamped Ashley under all aspects. Under LML Ashley had become lifeless with no real interest in business world, in close relationships with family, friends and men (she even shared a kiss with boring William Bardwell... the kiss of death!). She had become too cold and apathetic. At B&B she appeared younger, bolder and hotter without losing class and style. The problem with B&B is that when a new female character stops to sleep with a Forrester guy, Bradley Bell marginalizes her until her exit.

RestlessDuncan, great to hear your thoughts on Y&R. I hope that you post more often. You brought back the horrible memories of the bad writing during Malcolm's short return and Ashley destroying her marriage with Brad over her obsession with Victor. I am never going to agree about Brittany who I think should have remained a supporting character in the younger set and involved with Raul. Her "love story" with Bobby and then, J.T. really turned me off her and I disliked how Smith tried to make her into a young heroine. I did not mind the Mac/Daniel budding romance. I am not sure why they stopped it and sent her after J.T., maybe because Smith was about to write out Brittany and Bobby. I stopped watching Y&R regularly in 2004, the storytelling, characters, and dialogue felt listless and random. I had hoped things would turn around when Colleen returned at Christmas 2004, but she left permanently after a few episodes and I was pretty much done with Y&R then.

I can understand you didn't like Brittany at all:) Even Italian Y&R fans loved or hated her, there was no middle way. I liked that she wasn't a cliche, the rich blond superficial type of girl always seen in movies and tv series. She proved to be more than that. She was smart, I liked her lines and how she was sarcastic with people. She was a character well developed , Brittany's devolopment came full-circle. I never saw her like a 'heroine' , the kind of girl that always follows her heart and needs to feel loved or to have a man in her life to fulfill her needs and desires She belonged to herself and no one else. Billy, Sean, Raul, Bobby were like the bunch of good-looking men around Madonna in her Material Girl video ("Some boys romance, some boys slow dance, that's all right with me, if they can't raise my interest, then I have to let them be. Boys may come and boys may go, experience has made me rich and now they're after me"). The relationship between her and J.T. was different, because they were friends before falling in love, and friendship maybe is the greatest and endless form of love. Brittany didn't try to please people. She was a strong-willed person. She first wanted to be popular, then a famous singer. She didn't hide herself, who she was and wanted to be. And she learned from her mistakes. Her scar on face taught her to see beyond surface, in her personal and artistic life (Danny Romalotti explained to her how a songwriter should show the pain inside using songs).

About Ashley, I like ED and the character but only Bill Bell and Kay Alden were really able to give her good storylines. Other writers unfortunately didn't get her.

soapfan770, I liked reading your take on Y&R. IMO, 2004 was when the show went from stellar to BS. I don't think that it is a coincidence that David Shaughnessy and Trent Jones left then. Smith sowed the seeds of his demise in 2004 and worse yet, he seriously damaged the show. So many things drove me away in 2004, Cameron and Sharon, Brittany's rise to prominence, J.T.'s involvement with her and then Mac, being ticked off that I got sucked in when Colleen only returned for a few episodes, but ultimately the cringeworthy redemption of Kevin was the last straw.

Hi everybody! I'm Italian so I apologize if my english is incorrect or If I do grammar/meaning mistakes. I really love Y&R (even if in Italy was axed in 2009 due to budget cuts). I liked Jack Smith as headwriter. His writing was character-driven and the show under him was still classic Y&R. He did very good in 2003 with storylines like Safra VS Tuvia, Nick VS Victor, Bad Kevin, Ashley's meltdown, J.T. as knight in snining armor, Brittany as the young Madonna Ciccone of daytime (a girl who was not afraid of her sexuality and didn't want to be judged, a girl that wanted to be independent from family and from men - that is why he dumped Raul, who was unable to accept and understand her completely). Even the beginning of the Kay-Jill relantioship as mother & daughter was written beautifully: complex with some powerful scenes (dramatic and comic).

I agree with you that in 2004 JS did mistakes. Letting Heather Tom go was a HUGE mistake. He softened too much Victor and Jack, making them without real purpose (they both even left their business affairs for a while). The Cameron Kirsten story was enjoyable, but too lame and lasted too long. Ashley become too obsessed with Victor and destroyed her marriage with Brad without a real reason. The Nikki-Joshua Cassen story had its points, but it seemed too rushed in the end. Kay's ex lover and Jill's presumed real father was a fiasco (I really liked only the intervention episode) . Damon Porter was introduced in 2003 as a warm and zen man and in 2004 with his new storyline (the revelation that he had a young son killed by a bully young man) he suddenly changed personality becoming full of anger and revengeful. Malcolm's return from death : bad writing. I remember stupid lines like: "Oh, I was impressed by Africa because of lions and green pastures). Saint Mac's return proved useless. Her possibly romance with Daniel was stopped before developing. She almost started to stalke J.T. when she understood that he loved Brittany and not her. I liked AB first run as Mac and Billy & Mac as couple. I didn't like her second run (and her new haircut, too). Saint Mac acted so unsincerely sometimes and played really mean. J.T. and Collen's love story was one of the best young romance in daytime history: their break-up was intense and poetic like their entire relantioship (even if J.T. famous pop star from day to night sounded not too much realistic). First love is always special and unforgettable.

After that, I enjoyed J.T. & Britt getting closer. They were best friends, they always had chemistry and cared for each other. Between them there was something more than love and something less than love. That made their relantioship so unique and so real to me. I never saw Brittany & Bobby like a real love story. I didn't care if I they had no chemistry. The real love story was the never expressed feelings between J.T. and Brittany: they never had the chance to tell each other aloud the words 'I love you'. Brittany was a strong character, she was the new Nikki Newman (the stripper storyline) but smartest. She started lo lose appeal in 2005 after wrong storylines (becoming mother and then J.T. fathered the baby). What I liked most about Brittany was her self-worth.