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YR actress decides to go recurring...

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Even ten years after Nellie Oleseon and friends were trying to make Tom Casiello pop for his bad writing, he's still managing to make me cringe. Comparing relatively meaningless, generic white characters who had been around in some cases not even two years with the way that Y&R has degraded and decimated the Winters/Barber families over the last 15 years is just pathetic. Narcissistic blather like this is one of the reasons why white gay men get so much backlash. 

Edited by DRW50

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On 27/08/2018 at 11:41 PM, Faulkner said:

 

 

 

Who are these people? :huh:

 

Image result for i don't know her gifs

 

On 28/08/2018 at 12:16 AM, DeeeDee said:

So a veteran family has to go and suddenly the Abbotts & Newmans are untouchable? Qwhite interesting.

 

I am not Christel's biggest fan by any means, but she and the Winters are absolutely integral to the canvas. IMO they are the family with the most interesting SLs and characters, thanks in large part to Hillary shaking them up. 

 

The Abbotts are already decimated now that Eileen Davidson is gone and they have un-Abbotted Jack. The Newmans though? If ever a family needed culling... I really do not need to see Victoria or her passel of generic children ever again... or another recast of Noah... or Summer. Abby can pipe down, too. The 'Newmans' are Victor, Nikki and Sharon, in my view, and Nick in small doses. They should streamline that family to those 4, keep the Winters going, beg Sony to free up some money for ED and Mishael, and slooooowly introduce the Rosales bit by bit. The guy who plays Arturo is cute, but the viewers are just not invested in him like that.

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12 hours ago, Darn said:

Some white gay guys have a habit of comparing their experience to the black American experience and I need that sh!t to stop. It's not comparable and doing so diminishes the intricacies of both.

 

YES. LAWD.

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10 hours ago, StepBack said:

Replacing one minority with another is bad optics though. 

 

Which is precisely why demoting CK and phasing out the rest of the African-American cast contingent is a big deal, even for someone like me, who'd otherwise be table-flipping over the news like the Pointer Sisters in the "I'm So Excited" video.

 

It's bad enough to replace these characters with NO minorities, or with more white characters; or to "exchange" them for other African-Americans, as if to say we are interchangeable and that no one would be the wiser (because, "they all look alike anyway").  But to phase out the African-American characters -- save for one or two, who really will be like "tokens" now on the show -- in order to phase in a new Latinx family?

 

First of all, like I've said before, it suggests that TPTB believe that only one non-Caucasian group can co-exist on Y&R with the other, Caucasian families.  

 

Second, although I'm sure African-Americans have much in common with Latinos and Hispanics -- as we do with all people throughout the world -- to suggest you can replace us with them is just another way of saying all "Brown people" are alike, when that's really not the case.  There are aspects to life as an African-American that only other African-Americans could understand, and there are aspects to life as a person of Latin origin that only those who are Latino and Hispanic could understand.

 

Third, what TPTB don't realize (or maybe they DO realize, and they simply don't care) is that by doing this, they're sending two direct messages to the very group (meaning, African-American viewers) who helped make Y&R far-and-away the number-one soap.  The first message?  "We WANT to cater to minorities, we just don't want to cater to YOU anymore."  And the second?  "Thanks for keeping us at the top of the ratings for so many years -- now go away."  They've used us, made God-knows-HOW-many-millions off us, and now...?  They think there's more money to be made off Hispanic viewers -- when really, you can court one with alienating the other; and in this day and age, when soaps are going the way of westerns on TV, and broadcast TV itself is becoming more and more irrelevant to our daily lives, cutting off ANY potential viewers, regardless of their racial and ethnic background, is the last thing you'd want to do.

 

It's been suggested already on this thread, but I would have to agree: why "sacrifice" the one African-American family you have on this show (dull as they might be) to bring on the Moraleses, when you've done such a bang-up job in decimating the Abbotts, who've been a part of Y&R's core since 1980?  Papa John is dead, and thanks to Alzheimer's Disease, Mama Dina is on her way there.  Jack is no longer John's biological son -- which means Keemo (who's probably been re-retconned out of existence), Kyle and all other of his descendants are no longer Abbotts -- and most would agree that they've struggled for years to find something fresh for him to do, so Jack could easily leave town to uncover his biological father's identity and start his own company.  Ashley is about to make another exit (and since she, too, is not an Abbott, that means HER kids aren't Abbotts by blood either).  Traci is a recurring character who lives out of town, isn't involved in Jabot beyond being a shareholder (I think?) and (unfortunately) hasn't had a story to call her own in quite some time -- and HER daughter, Colleen, has been pushing up daisies for close to a decade now, too.

 

Ergo, about the only Abbott (by blood) left who could remain in GC and generate story is Billy...but you decide to get rid of the Winters/Ashby/Hamilton clan?

10 hours ago, DRW50 said:

Even ten years after Nellie Oleseon and friends were trying to make Tom Casiello pop for his bad writing, he's still managing to make me cringe. Comparing relatively meaningless, generic white characters who had been around in some cases not even two years with the way that Y&R has degraded and decimated the Winters/Barber families over the last 15 years is just pathetic. Narcissistic blather like this is one of the reasons why white gay men get so much backlash. 

 

Honestly, Tom Casiello should have just expressed outrage like the rest of us and then left it at that.  Drawing a false equivalency between Daniel Coulson and his victims and the Winters/Barber/etc. clan was just...sigh...I just didn't get it.

Edited by Khan

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I'm torn on this only because it irks the living hell out of me of the idea of phasing out one minority family for another. I mean. Are they for real here? How on earth do they think they'll be able to get away with this?

 

I want to be like "bye girl" don't let the door hit ya, but I can't because of the circumstances. I'm not at all upset she's "recurring" now. But I hate what it represents. 

 

Twitter is having a field day with Y&R. Matt Hanvey (I believe) gives me life with his tweets. 

 

I think the whole recurring thing is an attempt to save face instead of saying she was let go. JMO.

25 minutes ago, Khan said:

 

Which is precisely why demoting CK and phasing out the rest of the African-American cast contingent is a big deal, even for someone like me, who'd otherwise be table-flipping over the news like the Pointer Sisters in the "I'm So Excited" video.

 

It's bad enough to replace these characters with NO minorities, or with more white characters; or to "exchange" them for other African-Americans, as if to say we are interchangeable and that no one would be the wiser (because, "they all look alike anyway").  But to phase out the African-American characters -- save for one or two, who really will be like "tokens" now on the show -- in order to phase in a new Latinx family?

 

First of all, like I've said before, it suggests that TPTB believe that only one non-Caucasian group can co-exist on Y&R with the other, Caucasian families.  

 

Second, although I'm sure African-Americans have much in common with Latinos and Hispanics -- as we do with all people throughout the world -- to suggest you can replace us with them is just another way of saying all "Brown people" are alike, when that's really not the case.  There are aspects to life as an African-American that only other African-Americans could understand, and there are aspects to life as a person of Latin origin that only those who are Latino and Hispanic could understand.

 

Third, what TPTB don't realize (or maybe they DO realize, and they simply don't care) is that by doing this, they're sending two direct messages to the very group (meaning, African-American viewers) who helped make Y&R far-and-away the number-one soap.  The first message?  "We WANT to cater to minorities, we just don't want to cater to YOU anymore."  And the second?  "Thanks for keeping us at the top of the ratings for so many years -- now go away."  They've used us, made God-knows-HOW-many-millions off us, and now...?  They think there's more money to be made off Hispanic viewers -- when really, you can court one with alienating the other; and in this day and age, when soaps are going the way of westerns on TV, and broadcast TV itself is becoming more and more irrelevant to our daily lives, cutting off ANY potential viewers, regardless of their racial and ethnic background, is the last thing you'd want to do.

 

It's been suggested already on this thread, but I would have to agree: why "sacrifice" the one African-American family you have on this show (dull as they might be) to bring on the Moraleses, when you've done such a bang-up job in decimating the Abbotts, who've been a part of Y&R's core since 1980?  Papa John is dead, and thanks to Alzheimer's Disease, Mama Dina is on her way there.  Jack is no longer John's biological son -- which means Keemo (who's probably been re-retconned out of existence), Kyle and all other of his descendants are no longer Abbotts -- and most would agree that they've struggled for years to find something fresh for him to do, so Jack could easily leave town to uncover his biological father's identity and start his own company.  Ashley is about to make another exit (and since she, too, is not an Abbott, that means HER kids aren't Abbotts by blood either).  Traci is a recurring character who lives out of town, isn't involved in Jabot beyond being a shareholder (I think?) and (unfortunately) hasn't had a story to call her own in quite some time -- and HER daughter, Colleen, has been pushing up daisies for close to a decade now, too.

 

Ergo, about the only Abbott (by blood) left who could remain in GC and generate story is Billy...but you decide to get rid of the Winters/Ashby/Hamilton clan?

 

Honestly, Tom Casiello should have just expressed outrage like the rest of us and then left it at that.  Drawing a false equivalency between Daniel Coulson and his victims and the Winters/Barber/etc. clan was just...sigh...I just didn't get it.

 

THIS

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14 hours ago, Darn said:

Some white gay guys have a habit of comparing their experience to the black American experience and I need that sh!t to stop. It's not comparable and doing so diminishes the intricacies of both.

 

Image result for amen gif

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As a white gay man, nope, it isn't comparable. I wish it'd stop to. I think for some it's an "I'm with you" thing, and no harm is meant, but I get it rings hollow.

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22 minutes ago, KMan101 said:

I want to be like "bye girl" don't let the door hit ya, but I can't because of the circumstances. I'm not at all upset she's "recurring" now. But I hate what it represents. 

 

That's the part that gets me as well.  Under "normal" circumstances, I'd be over the proverbial moon about seeing less or no more of CK and her style of "acting."  But I know that complaining TOO loudly about what this truly represents could result in CK staying and/or being put back on contract status.  Like the song says, you take the good, you take the bad.

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Just now, Khan said:

 

That's the part that gets me as well.  Under "normal" circumstances, I'd be over the proverbial moon about seeing less or no more of CK and her style of "acting."  But I know that complaining TOO loudly about what this truly represents could result in CK staying and/or being put back on contract status.  Like the song says, you take the good, you take the bad.

 

Yep.

 

I just haven't ever really liked her Lily. Certain times I feel like I could get on board but she's just not who Dru's daughter should be to me. I'm not sad she's more or less leaving. But it's a massive slap in the face to basically write out one family for another. It's actually appalling they even have the nerve to try.

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I dunno. I liked the contrast and friction of CK’s siddity, Valley Girl Lily opposite VR’s Dru. The problem with SORAS is that we don’t get to see a child raised in real time.

 

The show has had zero interest in developing Devon as a character, and they essentially didn’t know what to do with Neil so they gave him an addiction and then a trip to the dark side. They had 10 years to integrate them into the rest of Genoa City and decided to keep them mostly in their own little ghetto, even though Devon was Katherine’s grandson. Yet they are immediately integrating the Latinx family with the Newmans.

 

I’m still curious if the plans to phase out the Winters-Ashbys will stick if Griffith takes over.

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1 hour ago, Khan said:

 

Which is precisely why demoting CK and phasing out the rest of the African-American cast contingent is a big deal, even for someone like me, who'd otherwise be table-flipping over the news like the Pointer Sisters in the "I'm So Excited" video.

 

It's bad enough to replace these characters with NO minorities, or with more white characters; or to "exchange" them for other African-Americans, as if to say we are interchangeable and that no one would be the wiser (because, "they all look alike anyway").  But to phase out the African-American characters -- save for one or two, who really will be like "tokens" now on the show -- in order to phase in a new Latinx family?

 

First of all, like I've said before, it suggests that TPTB believe that only one non-Caucasian group can co-exist on Y&R with the other, Caucasian families.  

 

Second, although I'm sure African-Americans have much in common with Latinos and Hispanics -- as we do with all people throughout the world -- to suggest you can replace us with them is just another way of saying all "Brown people" are alike, when that's really not the case.  There are aspects to life as an African-American that only other African-Americans could understand, and there are aspects to life as a person of Latin origin that only those who are Latino and Hispanic could understand.

 

Third, what TPTB don't realize (or maybe they DO realize, and they simply don't care) is that by doing this, they're sending two direct messages to the very group (meaning, African-American viewers) who helped make Y&R far-and-away the number-one soap.  The first message?  "We WANT to cater to minorities, we just don't want to cater to YOU anymore."  And the second?  "Thanks for keeping us at the top of the ratings for so many years -- now go away."  They've used us, made God-knows-HOW-many-millions off us, and now...?  They think there's more money to be made off Hispanic viewers -- when really, you can court one with alienating the other; and in this day and age, when soaps are going the way of westerns on TV, and broadcast TV itself is becoming more and more irrelevant to our daily lives, cutting off ANY potential viewers, regardless of their racial and ethnic background, is the last thing you'd want to do.

 

It's been suggested already on this thread, but I would have to agree: why "sacrifice" the one African-American family you have on this show (dull as they might be) to bring on the Moraleses, when you've done such a bang-up job in decimating the Abbotts, who've been a part of Y&R's core since 1980?  Papa John is dead, and thanks to Alzheimer's Disease, Mama Dina is on her way there.  Jack is no longer John's biological son -- which means Keemo (who's probably been re-retconned out of existence), Kyle and all other of his descendants are no longer Abbotts -- and most would agree that they've struggled for years to find something fresh for him to do, so Jack could easily leave town to uncover his biological father's identity and start his own company.  Ashley is about to make another exit (and since she, too, is not an Abbott, that means HER kids aren't Abbotts by blood either).  Traci is a recurring character who lives out of town, isn't involved in Jabot beyond being a shareholder (I think?) and (unfortunately) hasn't had a story to call her own in quite some time -- and HER daughter, Colleen, has been pushing up daisies for close to a decade now, too.

 

Ergo, about the only Abbott (by blood) left who could remain in GC and generate story is Billy...but you decide to get rid of the Winters/Ashby/Hamilton clan?

 

 

Truly an amazing post. With which I 1,000% concur.

 

They could easily have kept the Winters, what with the Abbotts down to a skeleton crew.

 

68fa7ed357a140909b9e62d8b642ec5c.gif

 

1 hour ago, Khan said:

 

That's the part that gets me as well.  Under "normal" circumstances, I'd be over the proverbial moon about seeing less or no more of CK and her style of "acting."  But I know that complaining TOO loudly about what this truly represents could result in CK staying and/or being put back on contract status.  Like the song says, you take the good, you take the bad.

 

1 hour ago, KMan101 said:

 

Yep.

 

I just haven't ever really liked her Lily. Certain times I feel like I could get on board but she's just not who Dru's daughter should be to me. I'm not sad she's more or less leaving. But it's a massive slap in the face to basically write out one family for another. It's actually appalling they even have the nerve to try.

 

10 years ago, I would have agreed with you (I enjoyed her recast Davetta Sherwood more than CK). However, it is a testament to how far Y&R has fallen in quality that Khalil has risen in the acting stakes. She is nowhere near the most feeble or annoying performer on the canvas. She is definitely above her fellow peer Melissa Ordway and her TV hubby Daniel Goddard in terms of dynamism, emotion and skill. And I would guess she actually has not had to up her game much from where it was a decade ago.

 

42 minutes ago, Faulkner said:

 

I’m still curious if the plans to phase out the Winters-Ashbys will stick if Griffith takes over.

 

Just as Eileen Davidson and Mishael Morgan leaving was due in large part to money negotiations with Sony/CBS, I believe this phase-out is a Steve Kent/Angelica mandate. Something about the way they wrote MM out.... it was so petty and seemed to reflect network/production ill-will towards the actress. Was Sony pissed that a black chaick dared to ask for a raise after 4 years of wage freezes? From that moment, I suspect the die was cast with regards to TPTB deciding to do away with the Winters as a clan.

 

Consequently, I can't see Griffith turning back time on this decision. He is lumbered with writing for the new canvas.

Edited by Cat

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24 minutes ago, Cat said:

Just as Eileen Davidson and Mishael Morgan leaving was due in large part to money negotiations with Sony/CBS, I believe this phase-out is a Steve Kent/Angelica mandate. Something about the way they wrote MM out.... it was so petty and seemed to reflect network/production ill-will towards the actress. Was Sony pissed that a black chaick dared to ask for a raise after 4 years of wage freezes? From that moment, I suspect the die was cast with regards to TPTB deciding to do away with the Winters as a clan.

 

Consequently, I can't see Griffith turning back time on this decision. He is lumbered with writing for the new canvas.

Certainly, you’re probably right. Of all the characters on the show, the Winters-Ashbys feel most “expendable” in terms of how they are treated. And you can’t seem to have more than 1-2 black men on contract at a time without one suffering, and they seem to be betting the farm on Nate (at the moment, at least). 

 

Even with all of this, you have to think Peter Bergman must feel at least somewhat vulnerable. He does have a son on canvas, which helps, but his story options feel increasingly limited.

Edited by Faulkner

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Well, after years of complaining on this board about how CK and BJ needed recasting, maybe the show heard you all. Maybe the read the myriad of complaints about how the Winters were boring and needed to go and decided the time was now. 

 

Disclaimer: Yes, I'm bitter. And your, meaning most of you, current hypocrisy is giving me someone to attack. Thank you! 

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11 minutes ago, ajsp35801 said:

Well, after years of complaining on this board about how CK and BJ needed recasting, maybe the show heard you all. Maybe the read the myriad of complaints about how the Winters were boring and needed to go and decided the time was now. 

 

Disclaimer: Yes, I'm bitter. And your, meaning most of you, current hypocrisy is giving me someone to attack. Thank you! 

 

You're blaming us? Hindsight sure is a fine thing. I don't think I have complained about CK since MAB era and her acting on the church steps as Cane got shot! That was, like, 3 lifetimes ago. Since then, calls for CK to go have quieted down to considerably as fans vent on more important matters -- like the wilful destruction of this once-great show.

 

FYI I have never called for BJ to be recast.

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2 minutes ago, Cat said:

 

You're blaming us? Hindsight sure is a fine thing. I don't think I have complained about CK since MAB era and her acting on the church steps as Cane got shot! That was, like, 3 lifetimes ago. Since then, calls for CK to go have quieted down to considerably as fans vent on more important matters -- like the wilful destruction of this once-great show.

 

FYI I have never called for BJ to be recast.

 

I'm not blaming you, meaning this board, at all. Just pointing out how the show is finally hearing the loud cries that echoed through threads of this board for years. When it was announced that Mishael was leaving, the first thing I saw was that Bryton needed to go with her and didn't deserve his place on the show. 

 

You, specifically, may not have complained about CK. But the complaints were listed here on the regular my many others. 

 

While ever complaint Ive read here is valid and I agree with them, I can't help but think the show is giving folks exactly what they asked for. Now if Amelia Heinle is next...

 

 

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