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As The World Turns Discussion Thread

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7 hours ago, Khan said:

I'd be curious as to what (if any) story projections they had written for OLTL and SOMERSET.  They're listed among the Dobsons' papers; however, I don't recall their ever having written for either show.

 

I'm wondering if the Dobson's auditioned/applied to be head-writers for both OLTL and Somerset.. and these outlines/projections were their audition for the job?

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2 hours ago, Paul Raven said:

thank you for alerting me to this fabulous resource. 

 

You liked that? 

 

Procter & Gamble Television Script Collection:

http://digicoll.library.wisc.edu/cgi/f/findaid/findaid-idx?c=wiarchives;cc=wiarchives;view=text;rgn=main;didno=uw-whs-mss00784

 

The Irna Phillips Papers:

http://digicoll.library.wisc.edu/cgi/f/findaid/findaid-idx?c=wiarchives;cc=wiarchives;q1=as the world turns;rgn=main;view=text;didno=uw-whs-us0076an

 

Guide To The Community Life TV Soap Operas Collection:

https://sirismm.si.edu/EADpdfs/NMAH.AC.0108.pdf

 

As The World Turns Collection:

https://library.osu.edu/collections/SPEC.TRI.ATW/collection-inventory

 

William And Lee Bell Collection Of Scripts For Television Soap Operas:

http://pdf.oac.cdlib.org/pdf/ucla/pasc/wjbell.pdf

 

Ahh, if only I lived near one of these places...

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18 hours ago, John said:

I think Goutman was just an egotistical [!@#$%^&*]. I mean putting out a casting call when you are still talking contract with the OG, who spent 20 years in the role is just  DB move by CG and probably why CG balked at Noelle Beck's suggestion that Martha return to finish ATWT but CG refused

 

Oh, Goutman's over-inflated ego and reputation is well documented but it seems as though he said/did something that went beyond the pale because Byrne mentioned that what began as a contract dispute morphed into a situation that made it impossible for her to return to the show as long as he was there. It's just striking how, as she talked about (even by her own words she described her words as being "cryptic") her leaving, even though she was trying to keep her emotions contained and was mostly successful at it, one could still hear the emotions bubbling under the surface. I was surprised at how, even after a decade, you could tell how deeply she still felt affected by it. 

Also, I found it very interesting that with other actors on the show who had felt offended by Goutman (Scott Bryce and Eileen Fulton), they were very specific in offering details about what happened (Scott's firing and Eileen's marginalization) but Martha made it a point to offer only vague but pointed remarks as if she really wanted to talk about it but felt the specifics would be better left unsaid. Whatever it was, I suspect it was something more than just garden-variety disregard.

Edited by DramatistDreamer

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6 minutes ago, DramatistDreamer said:

 

Oh, Goutman's over-inflated ego and reputation is well documented but it seems as though he said/did something that went beyond the pale because Byrne mentioned that what began as a contract dispute morphed into a situation that made it impossible for her to return to the show as long as he was there. It's just striking how, as she talked about (even by her own words she described her words as being "cryptic") her leaving, even though she was trying to keep her emotions contained and was mostly successful at it, one could still hear the emotions bubbling under the surface. I was surprised at how, even after a decade, you could tell how deeply she still felt affected by it. 

Also, I found it very interesting that with other actors on the show who had felt offended by Goutman (Scott Bryce and Eileen Fulton), they were very specific in offering details about what happened (Scott's firing and Eileen's marginalization) but Martha made it a point to offer only vague but pointed remarks as if she really wanted to talk about it but felt the specifics would be better left unsaid. Whatever it was, I suspect it was something more than just garden-variety disregard.

 

I remember Noelle Beck talking about how hard it was for Jon Hensley to film some of their last scenes together which were so heavily focused on his past with Martha's Lily. Now that we know just how bad things got it sort of sticks out for me even more. Goutman seems so petty - I can believe the fan speculation more now that he gave Lisa something to do with a temp recast just because he knew Eileen wouldn't be able to be there.

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7 minutes ago, DRW50 said:

 

I remember Noelle Beck talking about how hard it was for Jon Hensley to film some of their last scenes together which were so heavily focused on his past with Martha's Lily. Now that we know just how bad things got it sort of sticks out for me even more. Goutman seems so petty - I can believe the fan speculation more now that he gave Lisa something to do with a temp recast just because he knew Eileen wouldn't be able to be there.

 

And he strikes me as the type who would use manipulation and psychological warfare to try to bring "talent" "to heel", especially someone who he thinks is asserting his or her value like a confident vet might wont to do (common in contract negotiations). I could see Goutman regarding the "talent" as being 'uppity' or acting above their station.

Goutman comes from a director background, and I don't know how many people have worked with directors, especially the ones behind the screen (as opposed to the stage where the dynamic is vastly different) but screen directors are known to have huge egos and tend to exercise them and the worst of the bunch tend to lord their authority over 'the talent'.

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Mind you, I'm only speculating, but it sounds to me like Martha Byrne had her own #MeToo situation with Christopher Goutman.

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10 minutes ago, Khan said:

Mind you, I'm only speculating, but it sounds to me like Martha Byrne had her own #MeToo situation with Christopher Goutman.

something along those lines because it had to be something so bad that she had to get out. If it was just his ego alone, she probably would have dealt with it & renewed the contract

Edited by John

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As The World Turns - February 29, 1984 & March 1, 1984                       It's nice to see vixen's Ariel and Diana in a scene.                                                  

Edited by victoria foxton

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On 2/27/2020 at 2:52 PM, Khan said:

Mind you, I'm only speculating, but it sounds to me like Martha Byrne had her own #MeToo situation with Christopher Goutman.

 

That did cross my mind more than once as I listened to the podcast, especially as she mentioned that her husband commented that she couldn't honestly go back to that place after.

If not her, I'm sure there has to be some #MeToo stories in daytime soaps.  Surprised we've only heard one or two accounts.

 

On 2/27/2020 at 2:54 PM, John said:

something along those lines because it had to be something so bad that she had to get out. If it was just his ego alone, she probably would have dealt with it & renewed the contract

 

And harassment is not always physical, it can be emotional and psychological. It is an abuse of power and at the risk of reading too much into a podcast, given what we've heard about Goutman, he definitely fits the profile of someone who lorded and abused his power over others, namely actors who he probably considered subordinate to him.

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The more i watch of John and Karen. The more i like them as a couple. The dinner party from hell was fun. Craig and Steve fighting as Giorgio Moroder Midnight Express played. Richard Fairchild's reign of terror sounds interesting. Craig and Lyla's scene was gut wrenching and raw. 

Edited by victoria foxton

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I just realized that Craig spent a whole lotta time in the hospital between the years of 1984-1987. I spent at least a full day or two in the hospital every year between 1984-1987!

That situation between Lyla, Frank and Maggie seems deeply messy.

I was very distracted by the music in the restaurant/cafe, was that a Sheena Easton song?

Thanks @victoria foxton these don't look like they've ever been uploaded to YouTube before! At least, not that I've seen.

Edited by DramatistDreamer

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I remember watching this one on WOST...one of the few I got to watch on there. Then I guess it's been passed around since.

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That November 1984 episode was pretty strong.. and I think it really showcased a community feel.  While it isn't Marland esque, I think it holds up pretty well.   I'm also guessing Lindsay Frost was fairly new as Betsy.. with the haircut to mimic Meg Ryan's.. plus her being more perky (which you could tell wasn't a fit cause Frost played Betsy more serious and intense than Meg Ryan ever did).

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I love the courtroom scene, and Lisa looking like she thinks she is in a 1940s Joan Crawford movie!  I love that Elle and Bob are there to just looked shocked and mumble to the person next to them..though the thunder was annoying as hell and should have been left out. Lucinda should have been there to ground that in Lisa's face.."You thought it was me..and it was the maid, that he was DIDDLING on the side!"  I wish Marland would have kept Lisa's McColl family..it was fun.

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