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2 hours ago, watson71 said:

 

 

According to the Another World Homepage Ada appears on February 28, 1967.  She is introduced as Liz Matthews hairdresser.  Her brother Sam lives with her as well.  Rachel appears on March 8, 1967.   Were they living at their house on Bowman Street at this time?

 

I don't think so.  I believe she moved into Ernie Downs's house, when they got married (1969 or 70).  After Ernie died, she married Gil, and then Charlie -- but stayed in the house she had shared with Ernie.   So she and Rachel lived somewhere else when they got to Bay City in 1967.   

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My inner child will always love that "You Take Me Away to Another World" opening, although I cannot deny the lyrics are completely insipid.  It is remarkable that it lasted so long—the visuals at least were probably half-dated by the time it premiered in 1987—but I wonder why Laibson or somebody pre-JFP never tried to revamp it.  I feel like with new orchestrations, the song could have fit in with the late '80s/early '90s soft-rock trend, and a new font and non-stylized photos of the cast would have been a relatively quick fix (and easier to update).

 

I'm also not sure how you could have come up with much better lyrics for a song named after the show, because every explanation I've heard put forward for what the show's title was supposed to mean—dare I say, even Lemay and Phillips'—sounds cliched and/or pretentious.  I suspect that's because the name was really coined by ad execs who decided they wanted "Another (As the) World (Turns)."  In hindsight, that probably made it the worst choice of all the soaps to have theme songs with lyrics that included the title of the show—along with Loving, which oddly enough I believe had the only other lyrical soap theme by the mid-'90s.

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On 4/4/2021 at 10:06 PM, Efulton said:

Felicia Gallant was based on romance novelist Jacqueline Susann not Alexis Carrington. Headwriter Robert Soderberg had been friends with Jacqueline. 

 

This is what I have always heard as well -- although I don't know enough about Jacqueline Susann to have a sense of what aspects really informed the character of Felicia beyond Fabulous Best-Selling Novelist.

 

On 4/3/2021 at 6:20 PM, denzo30 said:

Felicia started off as being cold and then all of a sudden she is a heorine

 

Was Felicia's evolution so different from Cass'? When he first came on he was portrayed as self-centred and calculating, and then once Cecile was out of the picture he eventually mellowed in order to be worthy of Kathleen. Wallingford joined their friend group around the same time and Felicia was mostly on the side of the angels after that.

 

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9 hours ago, AbcNbc247 said:

I just checked on AWHP in the correspondence section. In the interview with L. Virginia Browne, it does say that Jacker took over during the strike.

I wonder how many episodes were written by Jacker during the strike; I think the strike lasted 12 weeks. But some had episodes written way ahead.

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1 hour ago, Xanthe said:

Felicia started off as being cold and then all of a sudden she is a heorine

 

1 hour ago, Xanthe said:

Was Felicia's evolution so different from Cass'?

From Rachel to Victoria and Felicia most women in Bay City tempered their inner bitch for the love of a good man.  It is my least liked soap trope, (and not specific to AW necessarily), but I don't think most writers feel that a female character can sustain if she is unlikable.

 

Speaking of Rachel, and where she lived with Ada, I recall watching an episode from the early 1980's when Mac and Rachel were fighting over custody of the kids.  Ada visited Rachel in an apartment to discuss the supervised visitation issues that were being fought for in the divorce.  At that time, Rachel was living in an apartment and I wondered how long that set lasted as her abode?

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32 minutes ago, j swift said:

I don't think most writers feel that a female character can sustain if she is unlikable.

 

This is key. It is not always linked to a man (but it is particularly offensive when it is) but soap show runners cannot fathom a woman being a sustainable character if she is anything else than easy-going/nice/victim/romantic lead

I was JUST commenting on just that regarding Natalie on AMC who also started off fascinating and strong but clearly unpleasant at times and ended her run having suddenly become an angel from above (and a victim). But same with Sami on Days and so many others. Characters that start off ambitious or scheming never stay that way if they stay for the long run.
That's why I was mentioning Knots Landing's Abby earlier. That was a succesful example of a "bitch boss" character staying who she is in the long run, showing enough vulnerability at the right point to be something else other than detestable but not losing herself to a man or to show-business refusal to portray women as something other than saintly, bitchy or crazy.

Edited by FrenchBug82
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12 hours ago, j swift said:

From Rachel to Victoria and Felicia most women in Bay City tempered their inner bitch for the love of a good man.  It is my least liked soap trope, (and not specific to AW necessarily), but I don't think most writers feel that a female character can sustain if she is unlikable.

 

I think they did a pretty good job of keeping Donna's edge throughout her relationship with Michael. Maybe that's more of a credit to Anna Stuart than the writers, since Philece Sampler's Donna was a whimpering, simpering mess. Sadly, Donna mellowed too much (for me) when paired with Matt.

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18 hours ago, j swift said:

Speaking of Rachel, and where she lived with Ada, I recall watching an episode from the early 1980's when Mac and Rachel were fighting over custody of the kids.  Ada visited Rachel in an apartment to discuss the supervised visitation issues that were being fought for in the divorce.  At that time, Rachel was living in an apartment and I wondered how long that set lasted as her abode?

 

In early 1983, Mac moves Rachel back onto the Cory estate after she's left blind. Was she still living in the apartment at that point?

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That apartment was above the art gallery that she ran with Mitch after she left Mac. I know she still lived there after Mitch was sent to prison, so it's possible that she still lived there by 1983. Or she could have moved in with Steve by that point.

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Rachel moved into the house, with Steve, late in 1982.  Before that, they were in the apartment.  Mac moved out and had a place of his own.  Episodes had been up that showed this.  There is one where Mac offers the house to Rachel.  She was going to use it as sort of an art school and moved in along with that.  But, yes, Rachel did live in that apartment for the majority of 1981 and 82.

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In hindsight, was Mac a low key jerk?  He cheated on Rachel with both Janice and the woman who left her panties in his limo while he and Rachel were dating.  He cheated on his first wife Iris's mother/adopted mother/woman she believed was her mother.  He blurted out that thing about Amanda being his first "real" daughter.  He fought Rachel for custody, and the post above was the first time I ever heard that he offered her the Cory Mansion in the divorce.

 

In 2021 would we think of Mac as a guy who was stuck in an eternal mid-life crisis? 

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1 minute ago, j swift said:

In hindsight, was Mac a low key jerk?  He cheated on Rachel with both Janice and the woman who left her panties in his limo while he and Rachel were dating.  He cheated on his first wife Iris's mother/adopted mother/woman she believed was her mother.  He blurted out that thing about Amanda being his first "real" daughter.  He fought Rachel for custody, and the post above was the first time I ever heard that he offered her the Cory Mansion in the divorce.

 

In 2021 would we think of Mac as a guy who was stuck in an eternal mid-life crisis? 

 

I have said for many years that one way soaps have warped us is that they present the on-and-off again thing as romantic; couple meant to be together finding its way back to each other through difficulties; rather than what it is really which is toxic and abusive.

This cycle of cheating on both Rachel and Mac and the fighting and on and off and on and off is so toxic. Those people should not be together.
I don't think soaps have changed much in presenting that kind of behavior in a more honest manner but if this was real-life in 2021, I'd tell either of them to run far away from each other and find better spouses with more respect for them, self-control of their genitals and better match temperament-wise.

So to answer your question: yes, Mac wasn't very likeable if you looked at his actions and, even after she was reformed, Rachel was also still a pretty toxic person to be married to.

Their love story wasn't romantic; it was co-dependant toxicity.

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1 hour ago, FrenchBug82 said:

I have said for many years that one way soaps have warped us is that they present the on-and-off again thing as romantic; couple meant to be together finding its way back to each other through difficulties; rather than what it is really which is toxic and abusive.

As humorously evidenced by Mac disguising his voice to help Rachel when she was blind.  How did we think it was romantic that one's former wife would be so mistrustful of his willingness to show compassion when she had been through the trauma that he had to fake an accent for her to accept his assistance?

Edited by j swift
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3 hours ago, j swift said:

In hindsight, was Mac a low key jerk?  He cheated on Rachel with both Janice and the woman who left her panties in his limo while he and Rachel were dating.  He cheated on his first wife Iris's mother/adopted mother/woman she believed was her mother.  He blurted out that thing about Amanda being his first "real" daughter.  He fought Rachel for custody, and the post above was the first time I ever heard that he offered her the Cory Mansion in the divorce.

 

In 2021 would we think of Mac as a guy who was stuck in an eternal mid-life crisis? 

 

The thing for me about the Iris outburst is it just feels so plot-driven and false. I can believe that Mac would have had a special bond with Amanda because she was his biological child, but - without having seen or heard the scenes - (if they are around I either haven't heard them or forgot I did) it is just so difficult to believe, so I can write that off.

 

I think Mac was a very flawed man, and written as such. If it was accepted, it's probably down to society's misogyny, but also Rachel refusing to be put into a victim mode as well as Douglass Watson's great charisma and rugged good looks.

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