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4 hours ago, AbcNbc247 said:

Michael and Rachel's previous friendship was just another mistake by a writer who didn't do their homework. That happened a lot on AW lol. When Michael was first introduced, he and Rachel were supposed to be old high school friends, which I don't see how since Michael and Donna were 17 when Donna had Vicky and Marley, meaning that Michael and Donna were in their mid 30s when Michael first came on the show, and Rachel was supposed to be older than that. 

 

I'm inclined to think that it was less a failure to do homework and more a desire to keep their mature heroines from tipping into middle age. By claiming that Rachel and Michael were contemporaries they blur the lines around Rachel's actual age. 

 

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Oct 1967
Barbara Rodell enters Another World as actress
Barbara Rodell didn't have to be brought up to date on the storylines of "Another World" when she was selected by.producer Mary Harris to take over the role of Lee Randolph. "I was a regular viewer of the program for several years before I had any idea I'd ever play in it," says the pert, pretty brunette. The New York-born actress took over the role from Gaye Huston, who left the show after several years to accompany her husband, an actor, to Hollywood. She had previously appeared on the serial "Flame in the Wind" on ABC. She also has played in "The Nurses," J,'The Defenders," "Mr. Broadway" and others. She was seen with Suzy Parker in "Behind the Glass." When Miss Rodell started her career as an actress it was in a Summer stock company in State College, Parshe has appeared in a number of other stock companies and in workshop, but as yet to make it on Broadway. Making of commercials and doing some modeling; has also taken some of her time to date. She "Now that i have this wonderful part in 'Another World I'd love to get something on Broadway. I want to do everything -- TV, films, the theatre, i -just love to act. And I'm willing to take things one step at a time."
 

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5 minutes ago, Paul Raven said:
Oct 1967
Barbara Rodell enters Another World as actress
Barbara Rodell didn't have to be brought up to date on the storylines of "Another World" when she was selected by.producer Mary Harris to take over the role of Lee Randolph. "I was a regular viewer of the program for several years before I had any idea I'd ever play in it," says the pert, pretty brunette. The New York-born actress took over the role from Gaye Huston, who left the show after several years to accompany her husband, an actor, to Hollywood. She had previously appeared on the serial "Flame in the Wind" on ABC. She also has played in "The Nurses," J,'The Defenders," "Mr. Broadway" and others. She was seen with Suzy Parker in "Behind the Glass." When Miss Rodell started her career as an actress it was in a Summer stock company in State College, Parshe has appeared in a number of other stock companies and in workshop, but as yet to make it on Broadway. Making of commercials and doing some modeling; has also taken some of her time to date. She "Now that i have this wonderful part in 'Another World I'd love to get something on Broadway. I want to do everything -- TV, films, the theatre, i -just love to act. And I'm willing to take things one step at a time."
 

Killing off Lee Randolph and then Bill Matthews were big mistakes by Robert Cenedella.  Both roles could have been recast or brought back later if the actors wanted to return.  They should have been the next generation of the Matthews and Randolph families. 

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7 hours ago, AbcNbc247 said:

According to Texas, Dennis was 25 in 1980, so I figure that Jamie was supposed to be like the same age.  I assume that Dennis was de-aged a little bit when Chris Bruno was cast. But if you follow the original timeline, Jamie and Dennis were probably supposed to be like 10 years older than Vicky and Marley. 

 

Michael and Rachel's previous friendship was just another mistake by a writer who didn't do their homework. That happened a lot on AW lol. When Michael was first introduced, he and Rachel were supposed to be old high school friends, which I don't see how since Michael and Donna were 17 when Donna had Vicky and Marley, meaning that Michael and Donna were in their mid 30s when Michael first came on the show, and Rachel was supposed to be older than that. 

 

On 9/12/2020 at 6:58 PM, Xanthe said:

 

I don't remember the early interactions between Rachel and Donna -- I do remember when Michael was introduced they indicated that Rachel had known him when they were younger, but not as Donna's boyfriend. But I did not exactly picture Iris and Donna as anything as vulgar as neighbours -- as the elite of Bay City I thought they might have met at society functions. And they did both know Brian, although being married to him and using him as an occasional proper escort are of course completely different things.

 

When Marley was introduced she was 17 and Jamie was at least 5 years older, possibly more. I don't remember how close they were supposed to be as contemporaries during the Jensen/Russell Todd/Chris Bruno stages of life, but for people closer to 30 a 5-year age difference is obviously much less significant. Marley and Jamie's much younger aunt Nancy were considered contemporaries during the Ellen Wheeler years as high school seniors.

Here's the episode where Michael and Rachel meet after 19 yrs. 

 

Edited by victoria foxton

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She's Veteran of 'Soaps' Virginia Dwyer Likes Daytime Show By HARVEY PACK NEW YORK
- The most successful daytime drama on NBC,  "Another World" has just passed  the five-year mark and gives every indication of being around as long as network television. Virginia Dwyer, a veteran of daytime serials who started back in the radio days, has been orbiting on "Another World" as Mary Matthews since the series started and the fact that she has chosen to renew her contract at every option time surprises even Miss Dwyer. "I've had running roles on other shows ("The Secret Storm," "Guiding Light" and "Young Dr. Malone") but there was always a desire to move on to something else. Here, every day is a new challenge and I think that's why we're so successful."
 
VIRGINIA, a very attractive woman has been at it so long she has seen herself suffering dramatically first as an ingenue and in recent years as a "mature" woman. She has also seen daytime dramas mature during that period. "I think the half-hour format motivated the change. It gave the writers more time to develop sub-plots and the actors and directors also responded to the ex pansion of ideas." Since the daytime serial is the last outpost of live drama on TV, it has the advantage of drawing its cast from the best actors trodding the Broadway rounds and "Another World" is no exception. "I was doing very well as a radio actress when the 10-inch tube arrived on the scene," she recalled. "But I went over to New York's Channel 5, then known as WABD Dumont, and volunteered to work in live drama for little more than the experience. The lights were so hot my make-up melted on my leading man's clothes but I was a television actress, and I've been at it ever since; "I WAS LUCKY.
 
Today's youngsters are so talented it's frightening. I watch them on our show bringing their experience with the 'method or improvisational theater into play and inspiring all of us with their vitality. "But eventually they must leave and prove themselves in theater or motion pictures and it's a very rough road." Virginia points out that today's contracts for daytime actors are quite liberal about time off for ether theatrical ventures. Her husband on "Another World" is played by Broadway veteran Shepherd Strudwick who is currently appearing in London as one of the stars of Arthur Miller's "The Price." "The writers simply eased him out and can bring him back as soon as he winds up in the play," explained Miss Dwyer. "He's a tax accountant in our story and, according to the script, he's off on a world tour for business and you can imagine how long that can take."
 
ONE OF THE principal factors in what Virginia considers the turnaround in daytime serials from old fashioned soap operas to top dramatic entertainment is respect for the audience. "There was a time when they laughed at the housewives at production meetings and practically tossed the scripts together. Now we think our daytime viewers are extremely intelligent and not just people seeking vicarious emotional thrills. Naturalism is the trend in daytime drama and the audiences appreciate the quality." When she's on call, Virginia works from 7:45 a.m. until 5 p.m. but they pick us all up with a cab," she smiled. On radio she was often a mean, conniving you girl but on TV her face and demeanor have typed her as a nice lady. "I think I'll stick with it," she concluded. "Because after all the years in front of a camera, I'm finally learning how to relax when that red light is on." Copyright. 1969, by TV Key
 
 

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12 hours ago, victoria foxton said:

 

Here's the episode where Michael and Rachel meet after 19 yrs. 

 

 

So based on this they were making Rachel and Michael exact contemporaries (both in 8th grade) and their mothers both working single mothers. Michael says he's been away for 19 years which would be since 1967, consistent with Marley and Victoria's conception at that point. But Rachel also claims they were watching The Mickey Mouse Club, which should have been 1959 at the latest. If Michael was in 8th grade in 1959 that suggests he would have been closer to 21 in 1967, about 4 years older than Donna.

This version of Michael's early life also seems inconsistent with the version they had when John came on the scene. I may be misremembering but I thought they had Clara living on the family farm. I don't recall if they ever had her cross paths with Ada.

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Between Elizabeth Love's disappearance, Ryan Harrison's conception, and John Hudson's Vietnam experience, I've tried to do the age math before and it is a total mess.  We need a new soap term other than SORAS which indicates that post-collegiate soap characters are eternally thirtysomethings until they become grandparents.  Perhaps we could call them E30s? Time just moves differently in soapland. 

Edited by j swift

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22 minutes ago, Xanthe said:

 

So based on this they were making Rachel and Michael exact contemporaries (both in 8th grade) and their mothers both working single mothers. Michael says he's been away for 19 years which would be since 1967, consistent with Marley and Victoria's conception at that point. But Rachel also claims they were watching The Mickey Mouse Club, which should have been 1959 at the latest. If Michael was in 8th grade in 1959 that suggests he would have been closer to 21 in 1967, about 4 years older than Donna.

This version of Michael's early life also seems inconsistent with the version they had when John came on the scene. I may be misremembering but I thought they had Clara living on the family farm. I don't recall if they ever had her cross paths with Ada.

That's what happens . When a show has a revolving door of HW's. For example originally Michael had an older brother Eugene Garrison. Eugene seems to crease to exist. Once Margaret DePriest created John. 

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2 hours ago, Xanthe said:

 

So based on this they were making Rachel and Michael exact contemporaries (both in 8th grade) and their mothers both working single mothers. Michael says he's been away for 19 years which would be since 1967, consistent with Marley and Victoria's conception at that point. But Rachel also claims they were watching The Mickey Mouse Club, which should have been 1959 at the latest. If Michael was in 8th grade in 1959 that suggests he would have been closer to 21 in 1967, about 4 years older than Donna.

This version of Michael's early life also seems inconsistent with the version they had when John came on the scene. I may be misremembering but I thought they had Clara living on the family farm. I don't recall if they ever had her cross paths with Ada.

 

It's interesting that some folks find it surprising that Donna, Michael, and Rachel are around the same age.  I always assumed Donna and Michael's age lined up with that of Rachel, Russ Matthews, and Alice Frame. I'd put Sharlene in the same age-bracket, because she and Rachel had both been married to Russ Matthews.  I suppose, if you want to be literal, then Jamie Frame's SORASing does throw-off Rachel and Russ's age a bit. But that sort of thing happens on every soap, and it's usually best to ignore it.  The really hard-to-swallow age retcon for me was that of making Jamie and Dennis contemporaries with Marley and Vicki Hudson -- and by extension, Nancy McGowen.  If I'm not mistaken, when Nancy was born, Jamie was being played by Bobbie Doran, who was around 10 years old.  And Jamie continued to seem about a decade older than Nancy.  So when Vicki Hudson hooked her claws into Jamie, I thought it was a little creepy.  Especially, since the age difference was never mentioned in any of the dialogue.  They just started pretending they were the same age.   

Edited by Neil Johnson

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6 hours ago, Xanthe said:

So based on this they were making Rachel and Michael exact contemporaries (both in 8th grade) and their mothers both working single mothers. Michael says he's been away for 19 years which would be since 1967, consistent with Marley and Victoria's conception at that point.

It also highlights the plot hole of Reginald, Donna, and the baby pictures of her twins.  Reginald shows a photo to Donna, she goes nuts, turns into Philece Sampler, that detail gets lost for a while, there's a rumor that Donna actually had triplets and Scott may have been one of them, then finally it is shown that John is in the picture which scared Donna because she feared that he could have fathered the twins.  Spoiler alert: John didn't father the twins, it is all a red herring.

 

However, if Michael left town after the twin's conception, but before their birth, why was John present when they were born?  I get Reginald spiriting Michael out of town after finding out that Donna was infanticipating.  That fit with the reason that Michael never knew that he shared the twins with Donna when he came back to Bay City.  However, if Reginald was building secret rooms in the mansion, and hiring doctors to hide Donna in a special room at the hospital, why would he let John in to take a photo with the babies (see photo below from Another World Homepage)?

 

Reg and Mary ran away in 1969, so if Scott was meant to be the third triplet it also didn't make sense, because where would he have been stashed for the prior two years?  Also, how soon after Cheryl was born did Mary take off with Reg?

ffaw4.jpg

Edited by j swift

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3 minutes ago, j swift said:

It also highlights the plot hole of Reginald, Donna, and the baby pictures of her twins.  Reginald shows a photo to Donna, she goes nuts, turns into Philece Sampler, that detail gets lost for a while, there's a rumor that Donna actually had triplets and Scott may have been one of them, then finally it is shown that John is in the picture which scared Donna because she feared that he could have fathered the twin.  Spoiler alert: John didn't father the twins, it is all a red herring.

 

However, if Michael left town after the twin's conception, but before their birth, why was John present when they were born?  I get Reginald spiriting Michael out of town after finding out that Donna was infanticipating.  That fit with reason that Michael never knew that he shared the twins with Donna when he came back to Bay City.  However, if Reginald was building secret rooms in the mansion, and hiring doctors to hide Donna in a special room at the hospital, why would he let John in to take a photo with the babies (see photo below from Another World Homepage)?

 

Reg and Mary ran away in 1969, so if Scott was meant to be the third triplet it also didn't make sense, because where would he have been stashed for the prior two years?  Also, how so after Cheryl was born did Mary take off with Reg?

ffaw4.jpg

Lots of plot holes in the Love/Hudson/McKinnon story. I can help but think it had to do with the constant change of writers at the time. I remember the rumor that Scott may have been the "missing triplet."  i personally think that would have been one baby too many.

 

I can't remember what happened to Mary and Vince...did they just disappear or formally leave the canvas? After the initial story, the show floundered in what to do with them.

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38 minutes ago, j swift said:

It also highlights the plot hole of Reginald, Donna, and the baby pictures of her twins.  Reginald shows a photo to Donna, she goes nuts, turns into Philece Sampler, that detail gets lost for a while, there's a rumor that Donna actually had triplets and Scott may have been one of them, then finally it is shown that John is in the picture which scared Donna because she feared that he could have fathered the twin.  Spoiler alert: John didn't father the twins, it is all a red herring.

 

However, if Michael left town after the twin's conception, but before their birth, why was John present when they were born?  I get Reginald spiriting Michael out of town after finding out that Donna was infanticipating.  That fit with reason that Michael never knew that he shared the twins with Donna when he came back to Bay City.  However, if Reginald was building secret rooms in the mansion, and hiring doctors to hide Donna in a special room at the hospital, why would he let John in to take a photo with the babies (see photo below from Another World Homepage)?

 

Reg and Mary ran away in 1969, so if Scott was meant to be the third triplet it also didn't make sense, because where would he have been stashed for the prior two years?  Also, how soon after Cheryl was born did Mary take off with Reg?

ffaw4.jpg

I'm pretty sure the photo was fake because I remember Philece's Donna saying that John had already gone to Vietnam when the twins were born. I'm kind of glad they didn't do the triplet storyline. Donna having a nervous breakdown because she had triplets make no sense when you think about it. But her having a nervous breakdown because she thinks that her worst fear (John being Vicky and Marley's father) is true makes a lot more sense. 

 

Scott's true parentage was totally forgotten about once that storyline was axed. And Cheryl was a newborn baby when Mary took off. 

33 minutes ago, pdm1974 said:

Lots of plot holes in the Love/Hudson/McKinnon story. I can help but think it had to do with the constant change of writers at the time. I remember the rumor that Scott may have been the "missing triplet."  i personally think that would have been one baby too many.

 

I can't remember what happened to Mary and Vince...did they just disappear or formally leave the canvas? After the initial story, the show floundered in what to do with them.

Way too many lol. Each writer shoved so much history onto them that when you think about it, that was a very busy two or three years in the 1960's for the Love/Hudson/McKinnon families lol

 

Vince and Mary did formally leave. After Mary's Place burned down, they moved to Minneapolis to live near MJ.

Edited by AbcNbc247

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31 minutes ago, pdm1974 said:

I can't remember what happened to Mary and Vince...did they just disappear or formally leave the canvas? After the initial story, the show floundered in what to do with them.

According to the AWP, they sold the restaurant and left to be with MJ in Minnesota.  I watched the scene, it was soon after Mary had completed her training as a psychologist and there was dialogue about how she was going to start a practice in their new town.  Ada, who co-owned the restaurant with the McKinnons, was there to say goodbye, but there was no mention if she profited from the sale. 

 

The Reg/Mary story had so much potential that was wasted.  Mary could have been snobbier after living for 17 years in Paraguay with a full household staff (but never learning Spanish).  However, the production staff seemed to pattern her after Denise's portrayal of Leslie on GH, rather than knowing her range from seeing her as Susan on Days.  There could have been a legitimate triangle with Reg and Vince, given that Mary had only known the benevolent side of Reginald and she might not have liked Vince's controlling nature.  Instead, Reginald instantly turned to mustache-twirling villain,  Mary immediately accepted life above a restaurant (and never asked for a monetary settlement from the Love's), and most of her kids who were yearning for her return left town within a year.  There wasn't even a stated motivation for Reginald to return to Bay City after living abroad.

 

EDIT: I just recalled that John had been studying medicine with the OB-GYN who attended the birth of the twins.  Which is how he helped solved the mystery of Donna being haunted by the number of hospital room where she gave birth (does anyone else remember that part of the story, or are there any synopsis from the end of that plot?) and why he was in the picture.  However, if he was there, it seems cruel that he let Donna go through all of the strum and drum rather than just filling her in on what he knew.  

Edited by j swift

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15 minutes ago, j swift said:

 

 

The Reg/Mary story had so much potential that was wasted.  Mary could have been snobbier after living for 17 years in Paraguay with a full household staff (but never learning Spanish).  However, the production staff seemed to pattern her after Denise's portrayal of Leslie on GH, rather than knowing her range from seeing her as Susan on Days.  There could have been a legitimate triangle with Reg and Vince, given that Mary had only known the benevolent side of Reginald and she might not have liked Vince's controlling nature.  Instead, Reginald instantly turned to mustache-twirling villain,  Mary immediately accepted life above a restaurant (and never asked for a monetary settlement from the Love's), and most of her kids who were yearning for her return left town within a year.  There wasn't even a stated motivation for Reginald to return to Bay City after living abroad.

That would have been a much more interesting story to play. it would make sense that Mary would have seen herself at a higher social level and struggle to become blue-collar even if she tried. After all of Mary and Vince's kids left, there wasn't much for them to do. I wonder if the writers ever toyed with bringing Ben back. He was on for such a short time he was pretty much a blank slate.

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37 minutes ago, pdm1974 said:

That would have been a much more interesting story to play. it would make sense that Mary would have seen herself at a higher social level and struggle to become blue-collar even if she tried.

The story contains one of the anti-feminist themes that I hate the most.  Mary opts for a quick divorce from Reginald in order to be with Vince.  As an audience we are supposed to applaud Mary's humility at not asking for a settlement in order to be with the man she loves, as opposed to the reality that this guy essentially kidnapped her, took her away from her kids, and owed her some cash for pain and suffering.  I mean at the very least, Mary could have gotten the house in Paraguay... 

 

Also, I agree that Ben makes more sense as a historical character to bring back as a protagonist in the Marley/Jake romance than Dennis.

 

Finally, how far do you imagine Lassiter was from Bay City?  I know metaphorically it was a world away.  Yet, I wonder practically how much contact the Bay City McKinnons had with the Lassiter McKinnons, given their geographic proximity. 

Edited by j swift

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