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2 minutes ago, Gray Bunny said:

Taking the high road has gotten us nowhere, sorry Michelle Obama.

 

I've watched enough trashy soaps in my lifetime to know that sometimes you have to fight fire WITH fire.

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19 minutes ago, Khan said:

 

I've watched enough trashy soaps in my lifetime to know that sometimes you have to fight fire WITH fire.

 

Exactly.

 

And I *really* wish they'd do some ads focusing on how Trump is NOT a Christian. Go for those narrow-minded evangelicals with their heads in the sand. He's not a man of God. He doesn't worship any God other than money. He doesn't attend church. He's not a member of any congregation. He couldn't recite The Lords Prayer or John 3:16 if his life depended on it. Point this out and focus on all the unholy, sinful acts he and his family have committed. If there is a God or Heaven, Trump is on the side of the fallen angel down below. 

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3 minutes ago, Gray Bunny said:

And I *really* wish they'd do some ads focusing on how Trump is NOT a Christian. Go for those narrow-minded evangelicals with their heads in the sand. He's not a man of God. He doesn't worship any God other than money. He doesn't attend church. He's not a member of any congregation. He couldn't recite The Lords Prayer or John 3:16 if his life depended on it. Point this out and focus on all the unholy, sinful acts he and his family have committed. If there is a God or Heaven, Trump is on the side of the fallen angel down below. 

 

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1 hour ago, Gray Bunny said:

 

Exactly.

 

And I *really* wish they'd do some ads focusing on how Trump is NOT a Christian. Go for those narrow-minded evangelicals with their heads in the sand. He's not a man of God. He doesn't worship any God other than money. He doesn't attend church. He's not a member of any congregation. He couldn't recite The Lords Prayer or John 3:16 if his life depended on it. Point this out and focus on all the unholy, sinful acts he and his family have committed. If there is a God or Heaven, Trump is on the side of the fallen angel down below. 

I don't mind ads like the one that make trump angry or feel even more insecure than he is. And I am all for going after trump for his record and I guess this ad hits both. Someone does need to craft something that targets the evangelical base I agree. Maybe showing clips of his favorable comments about Iran, who they hate.  That's one of the few things I have seen these cretins do.

 

As for Biden, outside of his foreign policy experience, I can't say I am interested. Maybe that's enough to return respectability but it doesn't really smash chances of electing someone worse than Trump who knows the system. Reagan and GWB were bad enough. And Biden has already been challenged on his bus tour about using his influence regarding his son. I will never say it's the same as anything Trump has done or Trump's kids, but it still stinks IMO and could actually be blown up as the next "but her emails". The press and media will do what they did with Hillary. Magnify that issue to make it seem like Trump and Biden are the same.

Edited by JaneAusten

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While I am indifferent generally to Biden, I adore Pelosi. This slamdown is warranted. And the question from that disgraced piece of garbage Rosen who left Fox due to sexual harassment allegations. I don't know who this toad works for now but this response from Pelosi is a thing of beauty(I guess according to Boykin Sinclair). Dems need to challenge the press and MSM more on their idiot questions and trying to horserace everything. 

 

 

 

Edited by JaneAusten

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Having both Biden and Pelosi show righteous anger is defintely a good thing and hopefully it's a sign of more to come. People are fond of saying that the Dems are "weak" or that they play too nice. These displays help challenge that. Plus for those who are just tired of the gaslighting and insults from Trumpists this just feels SO good to see. "You're a damn liar." How many times have you wanted to see someone say that to Trumpers?

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54 minutes ago, marceline said:

"You're a damn liar." How many times have you wanted to see someone say that to Trumpers?

Yes.  For me it goes back to Beavis/Kellyann waxing garbage about "well the alternative fact is...."   No honey.  There are no "alternative facts".  Those are called LIES.  An administration that yacks about "Fake News" and then they talk about alternative facts.  Such a bunch of hacks and crooks.  The comforting fact is that I know people in New York who say that Ivanka, Jared, the whole family - they don't answer their calls anymore.  They better enjoy these four years and maybe the next four - but they can't ever go back to NY.  No one answers their calls now.  Hope they enjoy the limelight and enjoy Florida because they ain' gonna have a life in NY now.  Strange that she identified as a Democrat (supposedly)...glad she's vilified now.  Hope it was worth it. 

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Yes, it is gratifying to see Biden and Pelosi stand up to the trash.  How sad is it, though, we have to single them out and commend them for behavior or attitudes that should be the norm?

 

We (and by "we," of course, I mean those of us on the left) should have been standing up to/shouting down the right all along.  We should have followed the lead of none other than the late Sen. John McCain, who (in)famously took away a microphone at a campaign appearance from a woman (and likely Trump voter) who was so concerned about his then-opponent, Barack Obama, because she'd heard he was "an Arab."  McCain didn't cuss her out or anything; he just told her, in so many words, to have a seat!

 

It's just like when I was in school, and I was being bullied constantly by classmates, and all the adults could say was, "Ignore them, and they'll leave you alone."  Well, I tried taking that high road.  I ignored them, believing that, by not coming down to their level, I was winning.  But do ya think they left me alone?  In the end, the only way I made my bullies leave me alone was to stand, and to fight.  Otherwise, I knew I'd never stand a chance of surviving.

 

Democrats need to stop "going high," because all that's done is guarantee us another four years of President [!@#$%^&*] Trump.  Between the GOP's hypocrisy and our own, stubborn refusal to turn the fingers of blame back on them with this Purity Olympics b.s., we've lost true fighters like Al Franken, who had a real chance of stopping that man in his tracks way before now.  Moreover, people who might have voted Democrat in this and the last election won't, because, in "going high," we've made ourselves look weak at best, out-of-touch at worst, and unappealing to them either way. 

 

Democrats need to stop being polite, and Start. Getting. Real.

Edited by Khan

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1 hour ago, Khan said:

Yes, it is gratifying to see Biden and Pelosi stand up to the trash.  How sad is it, though, we have to single them out and commend them for behavior or attitudes that should be the norm?

 

We (and by "we," of course, I mean those of us on the left) should have been standing up to/shouting down the right all along.  We should have followed the lead of none other than the late Sen. John McCain, who (in)famously took away a microphone at a campaign appearance from a woman (and likely Trump voter) who was so concerned about his then-opponent, Barack Obama, because she'd heard he was "an Arab."  McCain didn't cuss her out or anything; he just told her, in so many words, to have a seat!

 

It's just like when I was in school, and I was being bullied constantly by classmates, and all the adults could say was, "Ignore them, and they'll leave you alone."  Well, I tried taking that high road.  I ignored them, believing that, by not coming down to their level, I was winning.  But do ya think they left me alone?  In the end, the only way I made my bullies leave me alone was to stand, and to fight.  Otherwise, I knew I'd never stand a chance of surviving.

 

Democrats need to stop "going high," because all that's done is guarantee us another four years of President [!@#$%^&*] Trump.  Between the GOP's hypocrisy and our own, stubborn refusal to turn the fingers of blame back on them with this Purity Olympics b.s., we've lost true fighters like Al Franken, who had a real chance of stopping that man in his tracks way before now.  Moreover, people who might have voted Democrat in this and the last election won't, because, in "going high," we've made ourselves look weak at best, out-of-touch at worst, and unappealing to them either way. 

 

Democrats need to stop being polite, and Start. Getting. Real.

 

 

True story.

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Democrats took the high road in 2016 and it didn't work. Clinton's biggest mistake was not nuking Trump on the airwaves in swing states early. She could have framed him as a fraud easily by highlighting him not paying people, his bankruptcies, charitable fraud and so much more. She also should have ran an ad in Detroit, Milwaukee and Philadelphia reminding people of how he took out an ad calling for the death penalty for the Central Park Five, because if there was anything that could have gotten black voters to the polls it was that. Whoever is the nominee is in 2020 has to run against Trump's record and character, because the election is an indictment on Trump.

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31 minutes ago, ReddFoxx said:

Democrats took the high road in 2016 and it didn't work. Clinton's biggest mistake was not nuking Trump on the airwaves in swing states early. She could have framed him as a fraud easily by highlighting him not paying people, his bankruptcies, charitable fraud and so much more. She also should have ran an ad in Detroit, Milwaukee and Philadelphia reminding people of how he took out an ad calling for the death penalty for the Central Park Five, because if there was anything that could have gotten black voters to the polls it was that. Whoever is the nominee is in 2020 has to run against Trump's record and character, because the election is an indictment on Trump.

 

 

Clinton was probably aware that women are held to much higher standards than their male counterparts.  Much of the electorate will applaud a man who is vocal and can trade insults but when a woman does it, she is seen as arrogant and deserving of being put in her place.

Had Hillary went into a full-throated verbal assault on Trump, I just don't believe it would've went over well.  I don't have that much faith in the American public to give a woman the same space as a man in many aspects in life, including presidential politics.

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9 hours ago, Gray Bunny said:

 

Exactly.

 

And I *really* wish they'd do some ads focusing on how Trump is NOT a Christian. Go for those narrow-minded evangelicals with their heads in the sand. He's not a man of God. He doesn't worship any God other than money. He doesn't attend church. He's not a member of any congregation. He couldn't recite The Lords Prayer or John 3:16 if his life depended on it. Point this out and focus on all the unholy, sinful acts he and his family have committed. If there is a God or Heaven, Trump is on the side of the fallen angel down below. 

 

Billy Graham's con artist son and the others have already papered over this by saying no one is perfect and what matters is the results (the bigot judges). Most of the people voting for him don't care that he isn't a real Christian. 

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I don't want to say Hillary was a BAD candidate, or a FLAWED one, but...the GOP and the media had done a masterful job turning her and her husband into a modern-day Bonnie and Clyde.  Ergo, not only were her hands tied, because she's a woman; but also, they were tied, because she's Hillary Clinton.  She couldn't go after Trump the way she probably should've, because it wouldn't have been "ladylike," and because doing so only would've reinforced people's negative opinions about her.  In fact, I feel like she almost HAD to stand by and react passively to the attacks on her throughout the campaign, because the decades of bad press and ingrained public opinions had left her with no other options.

Edited by Khan

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1 hour ago, ReddFoxx said:

Democrats took the high road in 2016 and it didn't work. Clinton's biggest mistake was not nuking Trump on the airwaves in swing states early. She could have framed him as a fraud easily by highlighting him not paying people, his bankruptcies, charitable fraud and so much more. She also should have ran an ad in Detroit, Milwaukee and Philadelphia reminding people of how he took out an ad calling for the death penalty for the Central Park Five, because if there was anything that could have gotten black voters to the polls it was that. Whoever is the nominee is in 2020 has to run against Trump's record and character, because the election is an indictment on Trump.

 

I think the main mistake Hillary made was in taking for granted she would have more support because of how awful Trump was. People heard all about how terrible Trump was for a year or more, in ads from her, super PACs from the Democrats and from Republicans during the primaries, etc. Ultimately enough of them still went with Trump because they became numb to the attacks and because they decided it was still worth the risk to have a loudmouth and a piece of trash they could say at least was out there in the open and wouldn't be more of the same. 

 

Unfortunately, unless the economy crashes between now and November, I think a lot of them may make the same mistake again. 

1 minute ago, Khan said:

I don't want to say Hillary was a BAD candidate, or a FLAWED one, but...the GOP and the media had done a masterful job turning her and her husband into a modern-day Bonnie and Clyde.  Ergo, not only were her hands tied, because she's a woman; but also, they were tied, because she's Hillary Clinton.  She couldn't go after Trump the way she probably should've, because it wouldn't have been "ladylike," and because doing so only would've reinforced people's negative opinions about her.  In fact, I feel like she almost HAD to stand by and react passively to the attacks on her throughout the campaign, because the decades of bad press and ingrained public opinions had left her with no other options.

 

I didn't even feel like Hillary was that passive. She didn't go as far in the gutter as he did, but no one could have done that. The problem with going after Trump is it doesn't matter what you say or what you do - his supporters don't care, and the media will just go "both sides both sides." I don't think anything she could have said about Trump would have made a difference. She lost the election more on her own mistakes, her bad campaign teams, and the general longstanding media hostility toward her.

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