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As much as I try to disregard much of what Maggie Haberman writes, she does seem to have a point (for once) in her assessment that the Clinton administration was far more disciplined during the impeachment process.  Clinton didn't actually speak about impeachment, but chose to basically keep his head down and govern.  No one in the Clinton administration went on about presidential harassment, they just kept their collective noses to the grindstone and did the legislative and executive work of the people's business.

As big as Clinton's ego was (and still is), he kept it reeled in when he needed to whereas I don't believe that's possible with Trump.  That makes a big difference, imo. 

Also, Clinton had some scandals but not all at once and he seemingly moved from strength to strength in the economic and in the day to day business of governing while things just seem to be coming further apart at the seams for Trump Inc. Don't forget about the disastrous trade wars, they're still happening and those who don't feel its effects, will by Christmastime. Stock markets are teetering, the housing market is flaring up, once again and people are still talking about the very real possibility of recession.  If it were impeachment in a vacuum, with an otherwise well functioning economy, etc. (a la Clinton), it would be a different story but this time, this is not the case.  Therein lies the difference.

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There is also the fact that Clinton's impeachment looked clearly partisan and didn't have much substance to support removal. Trump knows that he is really in trouble here and even if removal isn't like because of the Republican Senate, the entire process can damage his re-election prospects even more than they already are.

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Also, put it in perspective: there's a HUGE difference between lying under oath about receiving blow jobs from government clerks, and using your powers of office, as president, to extort a foreign nation into digging up dirt on your political rivals.  One could have far-reaching consequences in terms of foreign affairs if allow to go unchecked.  The other just means you're sleeping on the couch for the time being.

 

1 hour ago, ReddFoxx said:

There is also the fact that Clinton's impeachment looked clearly partisan and didn't have much substance to support removal.

 

Another reason why, yes, I do agree IN THEORY with impeaching B**** K******** as well.  (He was on Kenneth Starr's "illustrious" team and supposedly one of the chief writers of The Starr Report).  What comes around GOES around, Playa Playa!

 

But, like I said, as much as I admire Kamala Harris for continuing the fight (as well as the narrative in my head of B**** being haunted by Kamala's face everywhere), I feel like we need to let that rest (for now).  I'm good with his knowing in the back of his mind that impeachment is ALWAYS a possibility and NEVER entirely off the table.

Edited by Khan

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5 hours ago, DramatistDreamer said:

As much as I try to disregard much of what Maggie Haberman writes, she does seem to have a point (for once) in her assessment that the Clinton administration was far more disciplined during the impeachment process.  Clinton didn't actually speak about impeachment, but chose to basically keep his head down and govern.  No one in the Clinton administration went on about presidential harassment, they just kept their collective noses to the grindstone and did the legislative and executive work of the people's business.

As big as Clinton's ego was (and still is), he kept it reeled in when he needed to whereas I don't believe that's possible with Trump.  That makes a big difference, imo. 

Also, Clinton had some scandals but not all at once and he seemingly moved from strength to strength in the economic and in the day to day business of governing while things just seem to be coming further apart at the seams for Trump Inc. Don't forget about the disastrous trade wars, they're still happening and those who don't feel its effects, will by Christmastime. Stock markets are teetering, the housing market is flaring up, once again and people are still talking about the very real possibility of recession.  If it were impeachment in a vacuum, with an otherwise well functioning economy, etc. (a la Clinton), it would be a different story but this time, this is not the case.  Therein lies the difference.

 

Ken Starr and Newt Gingrich did Clinton a big favor. They were nakedly partisan attention whores and extremely unlikeable people - Gingrich in particular is one of the most repulsive figures in modern political history. I have my doubts Clinton would have been reelected without Gingrich screwing up the optics of 1995 and 1996 as badly as he did. Starr handled everything about the Starr report horribly - the decision to fully release a report that was so incredibly crude was a terrible mistake, because it made a media circus focused on cigars and blue dresses, which made late night comedy fodder and which disgusted the average voter. It also shifted the focus to being about morals, which meant when one leading Republican after another was revealed as an adulterer, the public saw everyone as being the same, or the Republicans as just being hypocrites.

 

Nancy Pelosi is not a media whore and I think she will handle this judiciously and as intelligently as possible, but beyond the Senate roadblocking any real investigation, there's also the amount of apathy and partisanship out there now. Many people will automatically believe Trump because they adore Trump. Many others simply don't care. They see all politicians as the same, and they are more worried about not being able to pay their bills. 

 

I think Pelosi knows that deep down this isn't going to do anything, but she was slowly but surely put into a position where there was going to be a huge cost for the Democrats in 2020 in terms of voter turnout and donations if she didn't act. 

Edited by DRW50

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56 minutes ago, DRW50 said:

I think Pelosi knows that deep down this isn't going to do anything, but she was slowly but surely put into a position where there was going to be a huge cost for the Democrats in 2020 in terms of voter turnout and donations if she didn't act. 

 

Agree.  People from the left and far-left have stayed begging for impeachment proceedings to begin.  Until the Ukraine mess, however, Pelosi was able to fend them off by saying (and she was right) that they couldn't pursue impeachment against Trump unless they had hard and clear evidence that he was abusing his powers; evidence which the Mueller Report couldn't really provide.  (Evidence of wrongdoing on his part IS in the report, but good luck getting your average constituent to see what it is and where to find it). Otherwise, it really would have looked as if the House Democrats were performing a witch hunt.

 

 

Yes, folks, THIS [!@#$%^&*] again:

 

https://www.washingtonpost.com/national-security/state-dept-intensifies-email-probe-of-hillary-clintons-former-aides/2019/09/28/9f15497e-e1f2-11e9-8dc8-498eabc129a0_story.html

Edited by Khan

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3 minutes ago, DramatistDreamer said:

So now someone at CNN wants to emphasize proper standards? Puhleeze!

 

That guy is one of those "both sides" bozos. Just another reason to ignore CNN.

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