adrnyc

I got bored somewhere in the beginning-Spring of 1969. Is that where you are?

I never said anyone should just stop posting about the show. We all do that about all the shows. Our memories. Our favorite moments (well...some of us. For many posters, it seems to only be about everything they hated about every soap.)

It's a very select few members who keep asking over and over why the P&G soaps aren't being released. As I said, it's obvious: P&G doesn't care about its backlog - if any of it still exists. They don't have even have a soap opera division and haven't for 14 years, for crying out loud!

Yes, yes, CBS is producing a new soap and has approached P&G but, as others have speculated, they're probably not going to have any say in The Gates. They more than likely were approached by CBS for money to sponsor the soap and P&G will be able to get free or highly discounted ads during the show.

@Althea Davis I'm with you in hoping more soaps end up online and, like you, I think it'll only come from the fans if people discover old VHS tapes.

I don't understand what certain posters on this board need to hear in order to understand that P&G has made it perfectly clear they have zero interest in their soap opera history. Where's the mystery?

1 hour ago, NothinButAttitude said:

Their "family" scenes consisted of Margo taking a moral high ground and Katie or Craig getting scolded for their stupid, selfish act. Hell, most of Craig and Margo's scenes were of them in at Oakdale PD. I remember nothing about those scenes being warm and fuzzy, which has been my point. The relationship between the three of them lacked loved and complexity compared to other familial relationships on the show. 

And quit trying to declare who didn't watch the show or don't know the history just because they don't agree with your opinion about Katie and why folks felt she was a sh*tty, one note character. If I (or anyone else for that matter) have questions or concerns about the show's history, you are the last person in this thread I'd come to.

Furthermore, if you could read (again), the tapes comment was initially lodged at another poster. You brought your ass in here and assumed like it was towards you. I was speaking to you about Goutman and why people don't particularly like Katie. So please just..

You know what...I owe you an apology. I'm sorry. I see now how I got confused about who I was responding to for certain reasons. That's a product of multi-tasking - not giving my full focus to one thing. So I honestly mean I'm sorry and I hope you'll accept it.

I'm about ready to go into the Scheffer era and I'll do my best to post episodes that have warm familial relationships between those three siblings. (Should they exist. I'm willing to admit that my memory might be faulty. I watched them 15 to 25 years ago. What I've seen over the past 7 years are everything that exists on YouTube from the beginning until March '00. I've yet to get to where I began watching but I know it's before Rose came along and that's gotta be any day now.)

Sometimes, when I ask why people hate Katie so much, I feel as if people give me reasons that don't strike me as truthful to how things actually occurred on the show. That they're more people's perceptions of the character that I simply don't share. And I try to constructively argue as to why I disagree.

One thing I know about you: you clearly love As The World Turns. As do I. I'm going to try to go forward holding that in my mind and being more respectful. 

1 hour ago, NothinButAttitude said:

You must can't read b/c I said Katie and Margo's few scenes (none of them adding layers or progressing Katie) consisted of Margo either cleaning up Katie's messes or scolding her. 

And I've been watching ATWT since 1992 with my grandmother and mother. Don't try it. 

Clearly your didn't watch or you would've known about the scenes of Katie/Margo and Casey tapes.. 

I do know about the scenes re: Katie/Margo and Casey tapes...I guess YOU can't read because I had a paragraph about it in my post. LOL Margo and Katie having scenes together where Margo is cleaning up Katie's messes or scolding her...by definition...means they're in scenes together. Also, once Sheffer rehabilitated Katie back into the original character as under Lorraine Broderick's tenure, there was no need for Margo to scold her or clean up after her. Did you watch ATWT in the 00s. If so, I'd think you'd know this. 

Katie, Craig, and Margo had many scenes together where they fought, argued, and loved one another. Just like any family.

14 hours ago, wonderwoman1951 said:

exactly! all that history that was never explored. cannot recall katie and margo ever discussing casey’s death. and i don’t think katie and craig — her brother! — ever had a scene together. 

You must not have watched the show. Katie and Craig (and Margo) all had a bazillion scenes together over the years.

And when Katie first came on, she found the tape that Casey made asking Margo to pull the plug and Margo actually pulling the plug. There was an entire storyline around it where Katie hated Margo. Tom and Nancy and Kim and Bob - everyone explained to Katie what was going on at the time and how bad her father's condition was. (Remember Katie was only 16 so would rightfully be upset to find out her sister killed her father.) I've been making my way through the show and fall of '98 was just 18 months ago for me which was when the storyline took place.

Sometimes fans complain about the writers not knowing the show's history yet prove that they themselves don't know the show's history. Why? Oh right...because they didn't actually watch it.

Edited to @DramatistDreamer who seems to be reminded as well.

21 minutes ago, NothinButAttitude said:

Katie started selfish and ended selfish.

That's untrue. Again, having watched it recently...when Katie first came on, she was a sweet and likable character. Kind, considerate. Made friends with the other teenagers and was a confidante to many of them. It wasn't until Leah Laiman began writing (and actually it was 6 months into her tenure) that the character became a vixen.

You should watch Goutman's interview on The Locher Room for his point of view. I was surprised. He came across as knowing he handled the situation badly and felt remorse for it. He mentioned that there was someone on staff who had been let go a year earlier and that, if that had never happened, the situation between himself and Martha probably wouldn't have gotten out of control.

And I still will never understand this board's dislike of Katie. She's a legacy character for goodness sake. We saw her born. We saw Margo euthanize Katie's father. There's a lot of history there.

Speaking of history - am in March '00 and so much history has been coming up lately. Bryant's return has had Lucinda explaining to Jake all about Craig and Sierra and Montega. Kim disabused Denise of the idea that she and Bob and John are saints by bringing up the fact that John blackmailed Kim into marriage, after Kim was sleeping with Bob while he was married to her sister, Jennifer. 

I know we're not in the Sheffer period yet but, so far, lots of history is being used. 

8 hours ago, Contessa Donatella said:

I love & adore Donna Swajeski! Both at AW & later at GL. The thing about her writing AW during the strike & yes technically that made her a scab but she crossed over from the network, where she was a producer, and many many times producers write shows during strikes. 

A friend of mine wrote for AW & also for ATWT. But then he left NY, went back to school, got his PhD & taught soaps & drama at the college level. So, he dropped his WGA membership of course. Then when the next strike came Goutman would FedEx him the outline & he'd FedEx back the next day a week of scripts to Goutman. He picked up some extra change. Goutman had someone very good writing his show, who knew the show. But technically he was a scab. 

Anyone who "crosses the picket line to work" is technically a scab. 

Anyway, so nice to make the acquaintance of another Swajeski fan!!! I'm still mad at NBC for making her so mad that she quit. 

Yeah, it's interesting to hear about the strikes and how writers feel about them. My friend didn't mind at all that the show continued while they were on strike. He understood the directors/actors/crew, etc. still needed jobs. And that there was never any danger of the strike not coming to a satisfactory conclusion - they always do. That's why corporations hate unions so much! LOL

I never heard that NBC made Swajeski mad enough that she quit. She had quite the tenure there though!

15 hours ago, Contessa Donatella said:

Okay, that really works for me. Y'all don't like that time period, remind me why? And, thanks for the reply. 

I loved the Donna Swajeski period. That was "my" Another World. (It began with Margaret de Priest and the Sin Stalker.) I actually thought the show went down in quality with Swajeski stopped writing.

I've gotten the sense from my years on this board that people don't like Swajeski because she was a "scab writer" who wrote during the 1988 strike and then stayed on. That has always fascinated me in that I wonder how people know that she was writing in '88. 

A friend of mine writes for General Hospital, and during this latest strike I asked him who writes the show when it's on strike. This person told me that it gets farmed out to a private business that has writers on staff. So they're just generic people with no connection to the show and no connection to show business necessarily. They may be people who write short stories for magazines and the like. They're just given a breakdown and they write the script. 

But, I'm with you. I adore the entire Swajeski time and all the characters she created. Frankie, Ryan, Grant, Taylor (CRAZY therapist,) and how she wrote for Carmen Duncan's Iris, Matt and Josie, Vicky and Marley...I could go on and on. Easily the best period of the show to rewatch for me.

On 3/23/2024 at 9:00 PM, Contessa Donatella said:

Can't go. Would if I could. My god, that close! Can you talk it over with your guy? One person from my forum is going & one of my oldest friends online is going so I will get a great report after. Nadine Stenovitch has just popped up in my forum saying no one got in touch with her so I'm going to put her together with the woman who is doing this shindig. This won't happen again, this event, or one like it. This is it. 

I'm see if something can be done. You're right - an event like this probably won't happen again. And Alan Locher is probably doing a Q&A and can introduce me to some people privately. And it's just. So. Close. Thinking, thinking, thinking...

Ugh - I'm having such a struggle as to whether or not I'm going to the AW reunion in May. It's my 10th wedding anniversary and I promised my husband I'd not spend any money so we take a France vacation in August. But the event is only a half an hour from where I live. 

Anyone planning on attending.

12 hours ago, Althea Davis said:

We are watching The doctors at the point Karen found out her dad has died.

The quality has strongly IMPROVED. They removed a lot of the supporting storylines and gave them happy ends.

I like the new actress that is playing Maggie. 

I love that Nick has BECOME HUMAN... and is not so nasty and angry all the time.

It's become... can't wait to watch... type of entertainment. Love it.

Yeah, I felt the same as well as you. Although it was odd to get to know characters who were then written off the show, I didn't really miss any of them and the endings were good ones. I think I may be in the minority but, although I loved the first Maggie, I grew to like the second Maggie immediately. Glad you're still enjoying it!

On 3/8/2024 at 10:19 PM, DRW50 said:

Much of the hype for Sheffer at the time was about lifting him above ATWT, all about the changes he wanted to make to ATWT and wasn't allowed to do. Sheffer, Guza, JFP, Ron Carlivati, all hyped for themselves, not for what they did for the genre. We were never meant to care about ATWT itself when he was there - it was just the template for his work. Marland certainly put his own issues into ATWT, but he also respected the traditions of the show. When you run a show for almost 8 years, you will inevitably change the show irrevocably, but he still tried to keep the core intact. To be fair, by the time Sheffer got there, most of the core was gone, but it's still extremely difficult to watch a show where someone who seemingly has such contempt for their show, or their genre, is treated as such a god. 

The darkness under Marland was in some ways harder to watch because you did care about the people involved. You felt the pain. '00s ATWT was just a corpse being kicked, as you were encouraged to watch and laugh.

It's interesting to hear someone else's opinion because I couldn't have had more of a 180 degree different experience of that area. I started watching in the Leah Laiman era. Loved the actors but the story was so dull and boring. Then Sheffer came on and BAM - it was must. see. TV. When he left, I felt it was never the same. Frankly, even in his last 6-9 months, I felt as if he had run out of story but the producers also let go a slew of actors and I was in and out the last 6 years, although full-in for the final 2 1/2.

On 3/6/2024 at 9:20 AM, Mitch64 said:

I do think Bob and Kim and Lucinda were written well until the end...( I would have brought back family members but...and I would never gotten rid of John, he and Lucinda would be the Bizzaro Bob and Kim...totally committed to each other and their families but sarcastic, caustic and not above making trouble for others) much better than GL wrote for anyone other than Java.  But I disagree on Lisa....she would have been very easy to write for as she loved getting involved with  everyone....she would be another greek chorus making catty remarks on what was happening and helping, in her own eccentric ways, the wayward youths  of Oakdale. I do think that Lisa is more interesting without a romanctic involvement but she could still be in the action. 

I agree that John was a major loss for the show, especially because he just disappeared. No explanation, IIRC. But then again, Larry was always extremely vocal about how he felt doing soap work was beneath him - no idea why he stayed for decades other than it was a solid paycheck - so I could understand TPTB not having any respect for his longevity. Still...I'm with you that I would've loved to see John and Lucinda as the Bizarro Bob and Kim, as you put it!

1 hour ago, Khan said:

Any soap that lasts more than a few years is bound to evolve, with new characters and families replacing or supplanting old.  But, I believe that what makes a GOOD soap in that respect is that it still feels like itself even with all the changes.  Yes, there was a period in Marland's second run when ATWT felt dark - although, nowhere NEAR as dark as Passanante and latter Sheffer - but it still felt like ATWT (at least, to me).  And it didn't matter who was still on the show and on the front burner and who wasn't.  It still felt like home, if you know what I mean.  That's the difference we talk about when we talk about Sheffer in relation to everything else connected to the show.  His stuff might have been exciting to watch (...for the most part...) and a tremendous boost of energy after a period when it was clear no one involved knew which direction to go after Marland's death, but did it still feel like we were watching ATWT?  That's the question!

That's what I'm hoping to find out now that I'm back in the '00s. From watching everything over the past 7 years that exist from the 80s and 90s, it still feels like the same show as the 90s at least. The 80s was heavy with the entire Snyder family and now we're down to just Holden and Emma from that era. But the vets are all still there and active. (As of March '00) I've just come off of 2 years where Tom and Margo were front and center - Eddie, Tom's affair with Emily, Margo and Alec Wallace, his murder, etc. 

Bob, Kim, and John have all been heavily involved with Andy and Denise's baby, Hope. The two just got married in order for Denise to keep custody. John is not taking it lying down. Kim is the intermediary trying to help each see the other's side of things. 

There's a new crop of teenagers, which happens about every 3 years. This group is Bryant, Jennifer, Abagail, Christopher, Katie, and Adam. All of them, other than Abagail, we've known since they were born so I feel the ties to the past 7 years I've been watching. (SORAS is such a cruel disease - just takes years or sometimes a full decade after those kids lives! )

Hal has completely disappeared for the past few months - I wonder if Benjamin was off doing a play or something? Having been on the show for 15 years now, he's definitely missed but I know he'll return soon enough.

Most of the 90s characters didn't seem to make it through. Carly (who has felt like she belonged in Oakdale since Maura's first scene) and Jack and Molly are the only ones who've lasted. Oh, I forgot about Ben and Camille - they've both been on at least 3 years by now.

To me, as of now, it still feels like Oakdale. I'm interested to see what's to come. It's been 24 years since I last saw it so I may feel completely differently about it.

5 minutes ago, Vee said:

Nobody here is doing that. As you've been told before. I realize this is your new kinder, gentler revamp, but people and your post history have a long memory. So keep workshopping it and in the meantime let people talk about what they want to talk about. You're the one assuming everyone here was watching since the Nixon administration.

For example: I'm sure Jean Passanante is a nice person. I have long heard she is an exceptional breakdown writer. Many actors credit her with some of their greatest day to day material on certain soaps. That said, I watched her AMC run as HW. It was terrible. Her dreadful ATWT, GH, Y&R, OLTL etc. HW stints have all borne that impression out for me. Whatever the circumstances and BTS issues, some people are simply not suited for the big chair and bad is bad. And that's okay to say.

You're correct. It's also okay for me to say differently, yes? I've told you this many times before. At this point, I'm going to put you on ignore and I suggest you do the same. We don't need to see each other's posts. Which will be a shame because I love reading your Knots Landing recaps. 

On 3/5/2024 at 5:59 PM, vetsoapfan said:

IMHO, the absolute WORST was Roger Howarth, such a mistake in the role of Paul.

I do believe the "vet situation" improved under Jean Passanante, as much as I cringe at having to applaud her for anything, LOL!

This is one of my dislikes as well. Roger Howarth as Paul I just could never get used to through the, what, 6 years that he was Paul? I'd so loved the Paul from '02-'04 (I think were his 2 years - can't remember the actors name) that I just couldn't accept that recast. But that's about the only recast I couldn't accept.

And I will never be a fan of Passanante - which is hard because she's a friend of a friend and I know her. (Not well. But she's a lovely human being.) Alan Locher did an interview with her a year or so ago where, hearing her explain what she was dealing with from the higher ups, the network, P&G, the budget cuts, how she couldn't do half the things she wanted to, I do have a greater appreciation for her and what it must've taken to make things work for all the different voices wanting different things.

7 minutes ago, Vee said:

I first turned on ATWT in the late '90s. I saw Molly and Carly and their identical Indigo Girls haircuts caterwauling at each other like twins and I turned it off for another 2-5 years. YMMV.

I suspect a lot of people here didn't start watching when you think they did. Nonetheless, they're allowed to critique the show they love. Which you've been told before.

I agree that people should be allowed to critique. But there's a line that gets crossed between critiquing and just spewing hatred. And, I don't need anyone to "tell" me anything. I don't know who you think you are to feel the need to school me but I assure you, I don't need any such thing. I've been trying very hard to keep things civil. Please extend me the same courtesy. 

Molly, Katie, Henry, Carly, Jack, Rose, Lily, Holden, Roseanna, Craig, Mike, Simon...my favorite ATWT characters. I mean love, love LOVED them. Couldn't get enough. For me, Katie was one of the stars of the show. As was Molly. People who hated them...I'm assuming you were people who watched in the 60s, 70s?  Maybe 80s? I know a lot of people hate the Snyder family and don't consider it a "core" family. Although by the end of the series, it had been 25 years so I think one could argue they were the definition of a core family.

Now, other favorite characters, from my original aughts watch include Lisa, Bob, Kim, Lucinda, John, Jessica, Nancy, Susan. So, even as a "new viewer" at the time, I had great respect for the vets yet also loved all of the above mentioned characters, whom I'm only just now realizing from starting to watch the 80s in 2017 and am now up to March '00, are new characters or recast characters.

I realize now that I began watching ATWT at a time of great change for the series (even though Lily/Holden/Lucinda had been on the show for 15 years at that point and Jack/Carly/Molly had been on the show for 4-5 years at that point.) I can see why people who'd been watching it from WAY back when might have despised many of these new characters. But, with all of their Emmy wins during Sheffer's reign, it can be argued that he absolutely took a somewhat dying show (Leah Laiman?! Ugh) and revitalized it. 

Some posters have mentioned it was darker in tone. And I know I've read on here that many people don't like the Marland years for the same reason...it became dark by '89-'90 and remained that way until his death. 

It's just fascinating to me. Any show that is on the air for 54 years is going to have various "eras" that are beloved and hated by different factions of fandom. (Any Doctor Who fans out there? Talk about a divided fandom through it's original 60s-80s run and the 14 years of the new series.)

I think it's great that are these different eras. There's something for everyone to love. And instead of focusing on the eras one hates about the show; it's probably healthier to just focus on and watch the eras one loves. 

14 hours ago, Xanthe said:

Here's a creepy thing I had forgotten about the Sin Stalker: Dr Glaser had apparently been obsessed with Lisa for years because her mother had been one of his patients and most of what they talked about in therapy was Lisa's virginity for some reason. So Dr Glaser had been patiently waiting for Lisa and somehow ensured that she would move to Bay City to be with her aunt in 1987 so that he could marry her as soon as he had murdered enough filthy sluts to be worthy of her. And probably he had also killed Lisa's parents.

https://youtu.be/bAAA7t2PRno?si=5rna4EMMl6O1VSem

It was soooo creepy. And what made that storyline so fantastic. The entire storyline had been so sick and twisted and the reveal of who it was and why cemented how sick and twisted it really was. It was something you'd see more on primetime than daytime and maybe that's why it's so controversial. But my high school self marveled in how dark and scary it was.

I feel that Christopher came down to bland casting. I can think of 4 Chris variations that were just "bland likable white man." Some would argue it was the writing. Some would argue it was the acting. I'm for the latter. Just in terms of actors, they never had a Chris who could be the lead of the show in the way that Jon Hensley and Michael Park could.

I remember Kim always being active at WOAK. She was a "grandmother character" at this point and, by definition, those characters are always going to be characters that are "talk to" characters. I remember Kim being involved with Katie and Brad and having her heart attack at WOAK in the last few years. She was involved with Luke and Maddie. She and Bob were the "happily married couple." As a writer, I can tell you, there is no story there. The story becomes about them relating to their children. It's a natural progression of any story that goes on for 40 or 50 years. 

I remember Lisa as being involved in the Barbara/Carly storylines. Fashions still existed as a store on the "street set" we were given towards the end. (Not one of my favorites but when the budget is cut, you've got to create some generic set where people can meet.) She had been married 8 times (as she just said to Issac on the March '00 episode I watched a few days ago.) Her romantic storylines were over. As mentioned, she was attached to Bonnie for one thing. Now I'll be the first to admit that in the final four or so years of the show, she disappeared, absolutely. But that old gal had some story left in her in the early aughts - again...in relation to other characters.

Now that I've reached the aughts in my watch, as I've said before I will be interested to see how I feel about watching them having now seen the 80s and 90s.

And having now watched what's available of the late 70s and then 80s, and read the synopsis of the series since its beginning, it cracks me up when people think the quadruplets should've been brought back. Maybe it's a shame that the Stewart family got boiled down to Emily, Susan (another long term vet who was used a lot in the aughts) and Allison but hey, at least they were still there as opposed to the Lowells. 

Why does no one ever complain about the Lowell's grandchildren not popping up? 

It's interesting to read people's issues with how the shows "vets" were used during the last 10 years of the show. Having originally watched just those years, I considered Bob, Kim, and Lucinda a huge part of the show when I watched. Bob and Kim's marriage were the stability of the show. Lucinda had tons of storylines with both Lily and Rose as well as Worldwide and her cancer. Oh, and her boyfriend who was actually into Luke.

Lisa as well. Sure she had no romantic storyline but she was around a lot. Nancy was in her 80s in the last decade. There were times (even in the Sheffer era) where all the actress could do was sit in a chair. That's rather limiting to her storyline options. 

I think people also have to consider that, during those years, other "vets" were Lily, Holden, Ben, Jack and Carly who certainly got a lot of screen time.

We also got to see grown up versions of core families.

Hughes: Adam, Christopher, Casey

Munson/Ryan: Paul, Jennifer

Montgomery/Walsh: Bryant, Lucy

I don't know where this idea that the vets weren't used enough comes from.

NOOOOOOOOOOO! Those bastards. I'm right at the bottom 1/3 of Season 5. I'd only ever seen through Season 3. 

Luckily...kinda...I do have through Season 6 on DVD's that I got from a fan, like, 12 years ago. But they're transfers from VHS tapes recorded off the SoapNet airing. Not good quality. That's part of why I never made it past Season 3. 

I have to believe that, since someone went to the trouble of finally digitizing all the episodes that it'll find its way to another streaming service. Probably Max as others have posited on this board. 

19 hours ago, Althea Davis said:

Guys how do you rate the seasons from 1999 till the end. What are the good ones and the stinkers...? I am asking... for a friend. Lol.

That will bring various opinions - LOL. I consider Sept 2000 - Sept 2004 to be the second Golden Age of the show. The quality goes up and down from there. I thought the shows final 9 months wrapped things up well. Many people will feel differently!

Ugh. Nancy Bennett was one the reasons I quit watching in 1969. Partly it was her. Partly it was her relationship with Mike. And then partly (the old boyfriend/husband?) who became a patient at the hospital. I was sooooooooo bored. And Karen was gone. And Liz Hubbard was gone. They were still trying to make Steve a leading man pretending, in a very 60s way, that he hadn't done what he'd done and received no consequences. So I just jumped forward 2 1/2 years to 1972. I just pretend Steve is a different character who just happens to be called Steve and is played by the same actor. 

@Reverend Ruthledge and @vetsoapfan  Thanks for helping explain the Liz plot. I still have those books and should go back and read them again just for fun. Dying from being stabbed from the shard of a broken tea pot sounds just as kooky. I know distortions like that can irritated long time soap viewers but sometimes you just have to laugh!

@P.J. That about sums up my memory of '94. I would've watched that probably late 2020. I feel like '93 to '96 is pretty spotty. I have the 40th Anniversary ATWT book which has shortened recaps of years through '95 but it didn't really help much to stick in my head since I couldn't see it happen.

20 hours ago, P.J. said:

 

The NY shows definitely had better access to talent, and they would pop up in different roles. Phyllis Somerville (who played Annabelle Fettle, the baby broker) was also in episodes in '94 when Mike and Ro went to Montana, and GL in '90 as a mouthy attendant at a Spa Blake went to. Who knows how many the shows hired over the years. But I'll always know Sara Ramirez as Hannah, who married Jack and Carly in Montana.  

Phyllis Somerville!!!  I could not come up with my name to save her life. She was absolutely brilliant in everything she did on stage and screen. Interesting to hear she was also in '94 episodes (do those exist online? I don't recall seeing it during my watch through the periods of the show I never saw. And yes, how could I forget Sara Ramirez marrying Jack and Carly?! You're right that the NY soaps always had access to incredible talent.

1 hour ago, vetsoapfan said:

The death-by-falling-up-the-stairs myth is firmly ingrained in soap opera lore, but never actually happened. Liz Stewart on ATWT was seriously injured when she fell while running up the stairs. Critics have spun this as she "fell up the staircase," which of course is absurd and never happened. Folks just took pleasure in mocking the soaps.

 

Thank you for this! It's good to have the knowledge. As you said, it's part of soap opera lore and I've heard it mentioned so many times but didn't see it. I could swear that it even got into those "Soaps & Serials" novels from the 80s. I have the ATWT ones - read them probably 15 years ago - and I think that fake storyline made it into the book. Because I remember thinking "WTF is going on here? Why would they write that she fell UP the stairs? Did they make a mistake?!"