Queer as Folk

[John]

So loved Michael when he and Ben took in Hunter. Love that Michgael finally grew up and stopped being jealous over Brian and Justin. Loved the Mikey/Justin friendship that developed

[ChitHappens]

I agree with this. Ted and Emmett obviously didn't care for Brian all that much, yet they were with him every night at Babylon. Michael was just beyond pathetic. Life at work could have been really hard for Michael after Brian exposed him to the employee who thought Michael was interested, yet Michael could not wait to be around Brian again. Michael's mother even told him to move on. Michael himself said that he was waiting even though he knew he would always be Brian's back up plan. It was just ridiculous that Brian still had these guy's attention. I don't think that made sense at all.

Ted was as worthless and boring as they come. I didn't remember that his addiction began early in S2, one SL I have always hated. If they are going to go there, can the character at least be a tad interesting?

S1 finale - I totally forgot that happened to Justin, possibly because the follow thru was a huge disappointment. I think that Chris guy was jealous of Justin [as well as a self loather] because, if nothing else, Justin was brave. To come out as a teen and still go to school every day? That's pretty darn brave.

[marceline]

Same. He was such a pathological narcissist. I finally noticed how is almost pathologically capable of letting other people get any attention. It's startling how many times we see characters talking about their problems only to have Brian make the whole conversation about himself. Watch how many times he comes into the diner, plops down in the booth and starts talking about himself regardless of the topic being discussed.

[John]

So hate Dr David from Season 1

[difficultdiva]

Well, he was the one that Lindsey, Michael, Justin and certainly a huge portion of the viewing audience were interested in.

I mean, if Brian had truly decided (on a whim) that he wanted to see what sex would be like with a woman, Lindsey would have been in his bed so fast, Mel's head would have spun around.

It's not so odd, that Melanie, Ben and Debbie were constantly calling Brian to discuss things about their lover and/or child. Justin's mom thanked Brian for helping to support her son, when he wouldn't move back home.

This was the almost 30 year old man, who had sex with her 17 year old kid.

My issues with the Brian character, beyond his narcissistic behavior and acting like he was allowing these folks into his life (when it was the complete opposite) was the fact that he seemed utterly bored with his life, including all the sex and the men he was able to get, because he was the supposed sex god of Pittsburgh.

The lack of drive, interest and desire for getting what he wanted irritated the heck out of me.

[EricMontreal22]

I think this was a problem with importing the character from the UK version. Look, I certainly have friends in my life who I feel loyalty to and even love towards, and have known forever, but have some of Brian's issues (emphasis on some.) I just had a hard time that going into your thirties they still would frankly call him out on his crap so rarely.

I didn't feel quite that way towards Stuart in the UK version, where I got that. Some of that may have been that the actual dialogue writing was more nuanced. A lot of it probably was due to the fact that we just saw those characters for--what a year of their life? Not 5 or 6, so it was easier to buy. I also think Gale played Brian much more one dimensionally (but again that may be the writing, and I do think he improved as an actor) even if many people who prefer the US version go on about how Brian is, in a model type way, better looking he comes off as more vacant and less charismatic to me. As Diva says, he just seems so bored with everything for so much of the show. Even sex (which Stuart never was bored by--well not mostly.) I mean seriously, for as handsome as I do find Gale, how boring did sex with Brian seem to be most of the time? I would say that could have been the point, except with Cowen and Lipman or whatever the headwriters' names are (those Sisters guys ) they wanted to have it both ways.

Edited February 25, 2014 by EricMontreal22

[difficultdiva]

Stuart was usually always called out on his BS, but never with Vince or Nathan. Which made sense, because Stuart knew that he could get away with getting his way with his best friend, who was in love with him and the young man who never left.

It was all the other ones (Vince's mom, the older gay lodger, their lesbian friends and Vince's friends) who were able to see beyond the history between Vince and Stuart to see how they each were putting their lives on hold.

I loved it when the ONS walked up to Stuart and he called him out for not remembering him. Or the business client, who was so desperate to cheat on his wife and "hang out" with Stuart that it made him shudder in disgust.

I still adore how Cameron (Vince's Australian older lover) told Stuart that he enjoyed keeping Vince waiting for him in some desperate need to choose him.

Stuart definitely had his good, bad, dull, fiery, loving and angry side of his personality, but that was in the writing. It was in the source material. It wasn't this image that the character was based on and used for the majority of the time as his US counterpart.

I appreciated that Davies ended the UK version after the second series. I even read an article that said he felt like the first series end was were he wanted the characters to be left at, but Channel 4 wanted to ride the wave of critical acclaim and viewers who wanted more stories based on the characters.

[EricMontreal22]

Completely agreed.

I know Davies said (maybe in the introduction to the published scripts of the first season which are interesting with the cut material) that he didn't really see how these three characters (specifically 14-15 year old Nathan, who of course they aged up for the US version) could remain in each others world. This speaks to another problem I've stated having with the US version. Davies unapologetically always said he was writing about these specific characters, not the gay scene or experience as a whole. That's one reason the lesbians aren't really seen. Cowlip productions said in way too many interviews they wanted to represent the gay world as a whole--including gay women. An admirable goal but it doesn't work for me--aside from the fact that they simply didn't. I mean from one obvious perspective, where were the non-white people? And their world felt more insular to me--yes they had gay bashing, etc, stories but for an American town almost all of these characters lived in a very gay world, which made even less sense than focusing on Canal street in the UK version when Manchester does have a large gay scene compared to Pittsburgh or whatever the remake was. And that's fine, the US show worked best IMHO as a sorta gay fantasy, with some real issues. I just found the creators disingenuous and deluded when they insisted it was so realistic of the time.

But yeah, the second season of the UK version (which really plays more as a two hour movie followup) has a lot of great stuff, but ultimately was a bit disappointing, although I kinda liked the crazy Vince and Stuart fantasy ending that nearly everyone hated. As you probably know, CH4 was all set, and even got scripts written for a more sitcom-y spin off featuring Hazel and the other periphery characters but for whatever reason it fell apart at the last minute. I'm not sure how much I wouldhave enjoyed it, but it was probably a smart thing to do with the franchise instead of trying to make the central conceit work. (On the other hand, as much as I hated a lot of some of the later seasons of the US show, it undeniably came into its own when they ran out of remaking the plots of the UK version, for good and bad. Watching the US pilot and seeing much of the UK script replaced with some terrible one liners, etc, didn't give me much hope.)

I suppose if you wanted to sustain the basic setup you had to make the characters more forgiving of Stuart/Brian. But like I said, the fact that he didn't even seem to have any real passion for life, sex, drugs or whatever in the US version made that hard for me to take.

When I was briefly pursuing theatre at university here, the actress who played Lindsay (I won't use her full name just cuz I hope this doesn't pop up on her google search or something ) moved to Victoria because her husband became the new head of theatre at the university here. He has a big background, but also was always a bit creepy and high on himself (and MUCH older, she met and fell for him when he was her theatre prof, before that he was married to a popular Canadian character actress who has had leads on various Canadian shows like Corner Gas and Riverdale the Canadian attempt at a Coronation Street soap.) I did some work with her and I will say she's pretty awesome in person and did a production of Streetcar Named Desire here where her Blanche was, much to my surprise, phenomenal. I never really got that from her one note character on QAF (I won't even critique her acting on the ridiculously bad Dante's Cove which has a number of Victoria people in it because she was probably one of the better actors on that.) For the record Creators and some actors aside the US QAF probably was more Canadian, with much ofthe cast and writing team (I mentioned in the other thread one of my fave Canadian playwrights, Brad Fraser joined later on) being Canadian, and it was always fun to see the Toronto locations. The show was such a huge hit in Canada that apparently the Canadian cable network Showcase that co-financed it wanted it to run at least one more season, but that was nixed at the last minute.

[JackPeyton]

I think he was board, certainly. But he was damaged and scared of being in love and vulnerable fully so he let justin have pieces of him. He loved justin. He cared for him after the bashing, was hurt when he left him for the piano player, and I think we saw Brian reluctantly confirm to much of a "breeder" life he hated. He gave justin keys, he let justin top him handing over some control, he gave justin all the love he could give him and played by the rules set forth by Justin. I think with his boredom they addressed it by his almost moving to NYC but then not getting the job and starting his own firm. He also was there for ted when none of his other friends were for various reasons. Then there's him literally buying the farm for Justin, and his pushing justin away to push justin forward in life. His methods were not always the best, but I think to those he loved and loved him they got him. I think he had passion but was consistently at war with himself.

I think Brian was a very complicated and layered person. Characters like Mel Justin and Michael understood it and accepted it. People like Ben Linds and Debbie had to accept it he ages the ones they loved loved him so much.

[marceline]

I just started season 4. I'd completely forgotten that the show got a new opening. It went from Happy!Gay!Boy!Dancers to that B&W 90210 ripoff.

Edited February 27, 2014 by marceline

[JackPeyton]

I loved the second opening. And the first.

[marceline]

Rewatching has made me realize how much I've changed as a viewer in the last decade. Stuff that I used to find cute or intriguing (Brian's relationship with Michael) now seems really unhealthy while I have a new appreciation for characters I didn't really get into the first time around (Emmet, Deb). Of course the stuff I didn't like before now seems unbearable (all things Rage). One thing that has remained is my feeling that Ted is deeply, deeply mentally ill.

I can't figure out whether this show is more satire, farce, or soap opera. It can veers from complete inanity (again, Rage) service to clunky self-indulgence (Hunter likes girls, argh!) to deeply affecting drama (Michael tells Brian he knows about the cancer).

One thing that's cracking me up is how very, very bad the show was at hiding the fact that they shoot in Canada.

Edited March 2, 2014 by marceline

[Aback]

The show was dreadful.

The problem with Bryan is that the writers had a huge hard-on for him. Bryan would always *speak the truth* (like calling Emmett out on being a 'eunuch' TV host). Depicting him as the hero/anti-hero or whatever was all kinds of wrong. Justin, Michael and that other lesbian woman drooling over him was ridicoulus. He was just a sociopathic who happened to have very good looks. But the writers disagreed.

Emmett was also stupid, I mean, come on. As if he could really score all those handsome guys. Ted was probably the most relatable character to me. Oh, and Michael's boyfriend...

[ThePrinceOfSunspear]

Tell us how you really feel....I think Brian was pretty fantastic for being such ahole but I can see why some people couldn't handle his realness.

Emmett could come across very dumb and flighty but overall I grew to like him and I think his innocence was what helped in that aspect. I agree that Ben (I'm assuming that's who you're referring to as "boyfriend" even though they did get married) was was very amazing.

[EricMontreal22]

I don't think they even tried to hide the fact, unlike most TV shows, but it did make some parts--at least from my perspective as someone who lived for a while in Toronto and around the Church Street gay village--unintentionally funny. Like the whole charity bike ride storyline.

I think Cowen/Lipp were too earnest to realize when their show fell into camp. However, I am certain some of the other writers, like Brad Fraser must have realized it. I do agree with you that, despite my many complaints, the show was sometimes deeply affecting.