As The World Turns Discussion Thread

[Markjeh]

I'm really enjoying watching the older 2000 episodes. Henry and Katie scheming and the start of the Rose storyline are great to watch.

 

Does anyone know if this Curtis is the same Curtis that later appeared as Ben's son? Because according to soapcentral the latter apparently didn't appear 'til August 2000 but then I wonder why are their two characters named Curtis, both AA and both debuting in a relatively short time?

[Mitch]

I loved Katie and Henry scheming...I never could figure out why they made her a romantic heroine and him, well, straight.

Best case would have been Katie as the continued scheming comic relief character pain in the butt to Bob and Kim (who would consider her family since her mother was not in town) and Margo...and Henry as an out gay sometimes ally sometimes nemises of hers.

Rose should have lived and Lily should have died...

 

 

[NothinButAttitude]

It's the same Curtis (the character). I think they did recast the role though. Sometimes, SOC dates don't correlate with the actual debut of certain people. Some of their dates are messed up too. 

[NothinButAttitude]

 

[Soapsuds]

And shortly after she was let go as Sam….LOL…..I never cared for Sam. I preferred Neil over her. I loved the scenes between Hubbard and Adams. 

 

And a sighting of Jason Biggs….who I thought was awful on ATWT.

[DramatistDreamer]

AsTheWorldStillTurns has posted some episodes from 1987, some I haven't seen online before, right around the time after John and Lucinda's surprise elopement.

The episode where Iva comes face to face with cousin Josh who had been posing as 'Rod Landry' Lucinda's newest stablemaster.  

 

Also, there's an episode where there is a sweet scene between Craig and Sierra where Sierra tells Craig that she intends to name her unborn child Bryant (Craig's middle name) if she has a boy. At this time everyone, including Sierra and Craig, assume that Tonio is the father of the baby.

Edited August 20, 2016 by DramatistDreamer

[DRW50]

Thanks. I keep meaning to match their uploads to munecojim, Oakdalian, etc. to see which are new to YT.

[slick jones]

Does anyone recognize the actress portraying Mrs. Breyer...wife of the lawyer that handled Iva's adoption when she had Lily?

This is the first time I've seen the character...

[NothinButAttitude]

 

[DramatistDreamer]

Listening to raw recording audio from episode 12 of Radio Retropolis' Who Shot the Daytime Soap-The Rise and Fall of As The World Turns & Guiding Light online http://www.radioretropolis.com/ and I'm wondering if anyone has listened to this?

 

Interesting commentary but IMO doesn't give the full picture. For one, I find it weird that there was discussion of the signs of decline and cancellation being present but nary a peep about Another World and honestly, how can you not discuss AW when discussing the cancellation of two other P&G shows?! I wasn't even close to a regular viewer of AW and even I knew that AW's cancellation was a watershed moment, if not at the time, certainly in retrospect once GL and ATWT were in danger.

 

Also, I know that the OJ Simpson trial was seen as the beginning of the end, when daytime dramas started to struggle (although people often also note changes in the lives of women-more entering the workplace and not at home), but earlier this year I looked at the episodes from the early 90s of ATWT and when I got to '94 and '95 and I could barely get through some of the episodes! I couldn't help but wonder whether ATWT expected to lure viewers back with those storylines?!  I wondered whether other shows had similarly forgettable storylines during this time and had taken a lot viewer loyalty for granted. For decades, shows like ATWT and GL had pretty loyal viewers, there was probably every reason to believe that they'd return, also perhaps, they decided to put filler on until the majority of those viewers returned? Just a guess but maybe that's too far a reach? I mean, why would you save your strongest storylines for a future return of viewers when that may not happen? Why not put  out the strongest storylines immediately and promote the hell out of it, show the viewers what they've been missing?

 

Colleen Zenk was the only guest who commented on ATWT, which I am flummoxed as to why? Her perspective was still enlightening but I wondered how much of what she said was opinion and how much was fact. Her reflections were still great especially of how the NYC location of these shows was mutually beneficial to the show and the actors.

 

The podcast presenter did mention that he thought that the documentary that was done on TVG (later POP) would be just the beginning since he thought there was so much more to tell but he soon realized that TVG (POP) was only interested in highlighting the decline of the genre. I've always believed there was more to tell about the daytime drama, starting with its earliest history but I don't know if anyone has the interest or $$$ to do that volume of research and recording to tell a full story.

[DRW50]

I don't think I'll bother with anything that says OJ OJ OJ for why soaps declined. As you said, ATWT and GL were just not good in 1994 (and not that good in 1993  either).

[DramatistDreamer]

There is one person interviewed who stated that the reasons for the declines and cancellations of these shows were "complicated" but not just in the statements of some actors but across the industry, the OJ factor has become the accepted narrative.

 

I often wondered why ABC, CBS and NBC Daytime divisions, as well as production companies like P&G didn't pool their resources and try to get the Nielsen people to find a way to include statistics from viewers who recorded soaps via VCR then viewed later- especially in the 1980s when soaps were cash cows and might've wielded more influence.

Having seen a Nielsen box as well as knowing how Nielsen boxes work, I don't think it woud've been that difficult.  Nielsen eventually did this with online viewing and DVR but I think Primetime TV shows were the drivers behind this. Perhaps Daytime TV, despite all the high ratings and the fact that they were practically supporting their Primetime counterparts in the '80s, may still have regarded themselves as a 'red-headed stepchild' and believed themselves relatively powerless in driving change.

 

If VCR delayed viewing had been included in the Nielsen ratings, this may have made a significant impact in negotiations with sponsors.

[YRBB]

But why is Steve always such an idiot? Forgetting to pay the insurance premium? It really feels like forced drama for Steve/Betsy. I guess Marland really didn't like Steve.

 

Poor Iva. I had no idea she becomes paralyzed. 

 

I also have no idea wtf is going on with Hensley, Beatrice and all that lol But in an entirely different way. lol

 

Meg faking her pregnancy was so much fun. 

[~bl~]

The splitting up of ATWT and GL in the afternoon was a major thing IMO that hurt the shows in the long run. That only happened after OJ, and I partly blame that mess on how KCBS out of LA moved GL to the morning so they could show OJ material. It was "temporary", but well since one local CBS could move GL for something else, well why shouldn't others. 

 

bl (who hasn't listened to the podcast, but wishes that part of the story would be recalled...)

[DramatistDreamer]

If ATWT had its regular timeslot and never got moved, I'm not sure how GL being moved would specifically hurt ATWT. By the way, what year did that GL morning switch happen, I remember it happening but can't seem to remember when.

 

I still think it was a confluence of factors that resulted in ATWT's decline and cancellation.  One of which was tragic and impossible to prepare for- Marland's death.

Marland wasn't perfect @YRBB gives a great example above with how Craig evolved but Steve somehow never did. Regardless of what anyone may think of Runyeon, a character on a continuing series should never be allowed to stagnate but I have a suspicion that at that point, all parties were aware that Steve had a very short shelf life left on the Oakdale canvass.

Despite this, Marland was adept at tightly constructing his main storylines so that they had a definitive beginning, middle and end. At some point, ATWT stopped doing this well. In fact, all soaps pretty much stopped doing this well. One only need to look at the remaining soaps-many of which leave some storylines stranded, not even bothering to finish each before starting another.

 

I still think that if P&G and CBS had pushed Nielsen (like the Primetime shows eventually did) to stop using antiquated methods to measure viewing #s and patterns, they probably would've discovered that a significant portion of the viewers had migrated to delayed viewing after recording by VCR.   Daytime waited for Primetime to complain (only a few years ago) to make this an issue w/DVRs and online. In the 80s/90s most people weren't recording Primetime shows because they were at home watching, which was not true for many Daytime audiences who were working outside the home in increasingly large numbers in the 80s/90s.

Edited August 27, 2016 by DramatistDreamer