Loving/The City Discussion Thread

[EricMontreal22]

Thanks! The episode I found on video had no end credits--but was from March. The other two stories left me just as baffled and with no memories of them--Trucker and Stacey investigating some secret place of Caboott's with a crazy lady threatening to shoot them--and AVa Rescott withher husband in a wheelchair talking to her mom worried about Carly being in Chicago--then flash to Carly wandering the streets of CHicago, drinking from a bottle and flashbacking to running over some guy.

I started watching Loving briefly around the time I was started AMC--Fall 1991 when Ceare and Jeremy first crossed over (before Jeremy stayed) but then musta stopped till the following Summer or Fall when the week long Carter Jones/AMC cross over happened and that's when I became a regular viewer

[dc11786]

I've been using Google's news archive to search for old soap synopses. I found nearly complete weekly synopses for Loving from the beginning until about November 1986. I have some really weak synopses for 1987, but not as good as the ones for the previous years. There's enough to tell the basic outline of the story without going into all the details that some of the other ones.

I haven't gotta to 1992 yet, and my older synopses start in the August 1992.

Nearly positive the headwriter/executive producer for the episode you are watching are Addie Walsh and Fran Sears. I have a synopsis for the week of March 30-April 3 which states "Gwyn almost blew the plan to fool Hannah. Clay later told Gwyn he won't get Dinahlee out of town. Dinahlee decided to tell Hannah the truth. Paul and Ava went to New York to find Carly. Ally rushed Alpha Delphi, and idolized sorority big shot Staige Prince." Since this is the start of the college stuff, it really has to be Fran Sears and Addie Walsh.

Edited September 25, 2008 by dc11786

[EricMontreal22]

Well Addie did play up the college setting (something I liked) which is true for these eps--as you say. It was only a month after the new and final openign came in--which was Fran's doing wasn't it?

[dc11786]

I believe it was Fran Sear's doing. Sears didn't last long after. By September 1992, Haidee Granger was the producer and she was there through at least August 1993 as she was the spokesperson to the press when Bernard Barrows passed away. Joanne Emmerich was there when Nixon was at her height in the summer of 1994. Of course Jean Dadario Burke was the show's final EP. "Loving" executive producers didn't last very long in the 1990s.

[JamesF]

Okay so The City is a show that absolutely fascinates me because it represents the kind of variety I think daytime should have and the kind of things I've always thought soaps should try. Of course it got cancelled within 18 months which shows how much I know but whatever.

Having only seen the first and last episodes I was thrilled to see forum member bellcurve had uploaded some material on to YouTube of the Fake Quartermaines. How much fun is this show? Zany without descending into Passions style hijinx, great production values and characters that pop off the screen. Tracy in particular is luminous. A far cry from the seldom used wicked witch cariciature I've seen on GH in the past few years.

This really seems like a show ahead of its time.

ETA:

Alex: Your dad seems quite...gay.

Tracy: Doesn't he?

Love it.

Edited September 28, 2008 by JamesF

[EricMontreal22]

While I liked Morgan Fairchild on the show--it only really came together when Tracey joined. I didn't know her or her character from Gh but I was enthralled--I seriously have thought about becomign a GH watcher a few times just to watch her again but...

A few things to remember about the City. I still don't think it was given its fair chance. It started off rocky--and making a serial killer storyline that was a close clone to the just ended, and superior Loving Murders was an idiotic move--but the last 8 months or so were pretty much brilliant by my mind--it did exactly what it had set out to do.

It also at the time was the ONLY ABC soap to see its ratings consistantly climb each week in those last months--albeit by very small degrees. But they had already decided it was to be replaced. Apparantly it was an expensive soap to film--and I think the fact that many considered it still more Loving, a soap that had been given more than ten years to succeed, and for whatever reason ABC didn't own it but Agnes Nixon's company did (ABC owuld own Port Charles--and they could shoot it on GH's sets) was a big factor for hte quick cancellation.

It was repeated on our local ABC at 1am or so and I actually thought the late night was an even better time for it. That's another factor--it was force into the loser time slot that already was bad for Loving but maybe even worse for a "youth" soap.

[DavidEvanSmith]

I LOVED The City. Still mourn it to this very day. I agree with Eric, the soap REALLY came together when Tracy Quartermaine came on, and I think THAT'S when it really started to shed a lot of the Loving baggage tying it down. Featuring Debbi Morgan and Darnell Williams originally from AMC, Jane Elliot from GH, and a few faces from Loving, as well as exclusive "City" characters like Carla Soleito and Zoey, it became much more of its own machine.

Of course, I'm biased, Jane Elliot's Tracy was and is my favorite soap character, so a show that had HER as the centerpiece leading diva was a must-watch for me. It's the kind of prominence she deserved. It was also refreshing to see HER free from some of her GH baggage. Tracy always was getting kicked out of Port Charles by her father Edward, so it was cool that we FINALLY got to see how she filled her time when she was away from her family. In many ways, she was the same (blackmailing, scheming, money-grubbing, looking down her nose at people), but in many ways she was a better person away from the Quartermaines (happier, lighter, funnier... she would sing to herself in her loft!) because she didn't have the Quartermaines constantly throwing past failures in her face all the time. I loved to hear Jane throw in a line or two from a show tune while gliding around her loft when a scheme was going her way.

Because Tracy is such a reactive character, I was always interested to see HOW she would feel about one person or another. On GH, a lot of her feelings about people stemmed from who they knew, who they had been aligned with, and how they related to her family. In The City, it was a different ball game because people knew OF the Quartermaines, but didn't know them personally, so it didn't matter. I loved Tracy's dynamic with Jacob. There were always hints of racism or classism back when Tracy interacted with cousin Justus Ward on GH, but there was none of that on The City. I remember she hated Jocelyn (because Jocelyn was with Alex Masters, Tracy's "one that got away".) I loved watching Tracy's relationship with Zoey evolve over time. LOVED the rivalry with Carla Soleito. Was surprised that Tracy didn't dismiss optimistic blondes like Tess or Ally, because I really expected her not to take them very seriously. Don't remember Tracy interacting all that much with Angie, if at all, but would have been interested to see their dynamic because Tracy kept pulling Jacob into bad situations, and Angie was trying to adopt at the time, so imagine how bad Tracy could have made them look as prospective parents?

I thought the show ended SO well, with Tracy snagging the Soleito mob, just as Molly Malone returned to bump off Sydney and apparently had plans for the rest of the people back in The City. When word got out that Sydney Chase was found dead, and Tracy had coincidentally JUST taken over the mob, wouldn't Tracy have looked MIGHTY guilty?! Plus, Molly was obsessed with Danny, so I'm sure Molly would have had plans for the pregnant Carla, since she was carrying Danny's child. So if something happened to Carla, Tracy would have looked guilty for that, too!

I would have loved to see what happened, if the show had been allowed to continue. I actually wrote a few months of continuing story and still have it on a site. Molly continued her reign of terror and Tracy did look guilty and was scrambling to provide herself an alibi for all of Molly's crimes, while the Sydney Chase media empire was up for grabs and brought a few alleged relatives out of the woodwork to claim the Chase fortune... including a sister of Sydney's played by Heather Locklear (I could dream, couldn't I?) and someone claiming to be a new husband of Sydney's, who had allegedly married her right before she died... Marco Dane! (bringing Gerald Anthony to The City... and the actor might still be alive today, if he'd had some consistent acting work in the last ten years)

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[EricMontreal22]

Haha love your new opening (I always smile when I see how you've inserted yourself into it--very cute). i agree with everything you said. I know Haridng Lemay apparantly told ABC, when he was consulting, that it was an awful show and proved that you needed families to be the center of a soap--I don't htink he coulda been more wrong. They managed to show how you DIDN'T need families to be a core and couls still have a sense of community (setting it in the same building was a spectacular idea). I admit it's nearly entirely my lvoe of this show that gives me so much patience with Brown and Esenstens's other projects.

[dc11786]

Harding Lemay didn't say the show needed a core family, he said "The City" lacked a generational aspect to it. His complaint was the show was about a bunch of twenty-somethings. What I find interesting is that many of the fans of the show by either Tracey or Sydney, two older female characters. Based on those two episodes on youtube, Lemay's point seems to be proven. It is only when that generational aspect comes into play (Tracey vs. the Qs/Tracey v. Carla) that the show really becomes interesting. Considering Lemay's own work, I don't think he would say that core families are needed to make a show work considering the turnover of characters on his time on "Another World". He was stating that you cannot revolve a show around one generation, which seems to be a fair assessment.

[EricMontreal22]

Well the first 6 months of City *were* weak--maybe not weak but they were obviously trying to find their footing--and I guess that's when Harding watched? However, even then with Nick, Angie and Jesse, etc I'd argue he was wrong. And he did say he disliked it--which I obviously don't./

[Paul Raven]

From SOD Nov 89

LOVING Every Minute of It :Head writers Millee Taggart and Tom King Have a Most Unusual Relationship.

Taggart and King have been Loving's head writers since the end of the 88 writers' strike. The remarkable aspect of their professional relationship is that they work in separate locations. Millee lives in Westchester County,NY,while Tom lives in Manhattan.

"Tom and I have been a team since the early 80's. We're not married and we each have separate lives", Millee explains. "We're on the phone all the time and meet every Monday at the studio to lay out what we're going to do for the week".

The achieved result is not homogenized. Rather, it's two distinct points of view being presented, which suits them in a lot of ways. Taggart asserts, "We find that if we talk everything to death, we won't get the maximum creativity out of what we're trying to do. To me, it's the most natural way of working." King maintains, "it wouldn't add anything to work together. If you're writing, you're still working alone."

Not that they haven't tried the togetherness approach. As head writers for ATWT and RH, Taggart and King spent several years working out of the same office. In california, they also wrote two mid-season replacements sitcoms, The Thorns and Nothing in Common. Though the shows were shortlived, they gave the team the opportunity to write comedy, which they both really enjoy.

King insists, "We both like to inject comedy wherever we can. I think Ava on Loving is a hoot." Taggart adds, "I like writing daytime a lot.It's rather exciting because it's very immediate. It doesn't get over polished because there isn't enough time."

Often,the two writers will spend a weekend with Loving's exec producer Joseph Hardy, to discuss potential story lines. Then they'll go home,write, and, later exchange results. Taggart notes, "Tom has total freedom to change whatever I've written. We allow each other to be as creative as possible in the framework of a collaboration."

Taggart and King have found a way for two very different people to do the best they can.

[EricMontreal22]

Interesting--sadly I only saw Taggart's later era teamed up with Guza--but I think she's a great writer. I didn't realize they wrote for RH and ATWT together

[Paul Raven]

New Kids On The Block

LOVING’s Boys And Girls Of Summer Are Pumping The Show Full Of Young Blood

By Jennifer Woodhouse

You've read in these pages about LOVING's nationwide search to find new young talent. The hunt is over — now's your chance to judge the results. These fresh faces will be on LOVING's front burner all summer in stories that take the show, according to Executive Producer Fran Sears, "back to basics. We're going back to Alden University, which was so much a part of the show's beginnings."

Not that the kids are flying solo, without benefit of family ties. According to Head Writer Addie Walsh, "We're connecting them strongly to their families; we're not just isolating them." Cooper is an Alden, Casey is Gift's son and Hannah is Dinah Lee's little sister. The writers are using these relationships, as well as the fraternity/sorority setting, as springboards for the new characters.

The summer storylines revolve around Cooper Alden, their "wild card," according to Walsh. A traumatic incident lurks in rebellious Cooper's background. "We're building a classic quadrangle around him," reveals Walsh. Watch for action between Cooper, Hannah, Ally and Staige, with Kent acting as spoiler.

Ally Rescott, an outsider to Corinth society, will learn the hard way that social climbing rarely pays. She is the first to attract Cooper. But Cooper is drawn to the sweet, innocent Hannah Mayberry, to whom he will open up like never before. "Hannah is the person who perceives the troubled soul in Cooper," says Walsh. "And that will be a major plot point."

Meanwhile, Kent and Staige, AU's "face man" and "star girl" (terms the writers discovered when interviewing students about the Greek system), are out to cause nothing but trouble for Cooper. Nasty, nouveauriche Kent loathes the young Alden, and superficial Staige, Kent's girlfriend, wants Cooper — but only because he's an Alden. "Kent feels very threatened by Cooper coming onto his turf, which will result in physical and emotional injury for the young men," says Walsh.

Casey Bowman, Giff Bowman's son, will act as a sobering force on the scene. "He finds himself in the position of a child raising a parent, which has matured him faster in some ways, but he lost some of his childhood. He is the wiser one of our kids. He's going to have a very strong effect on Ally, and there will be a chemistry between him and Ally that both of them will deny. They're like oil and water, but the oil and water might do a little mixing," Walsh hints.

[EricMontreal22]

Building back up the campus was *really* smart I think--this was aroudn when I got into the show (with the AMC Carter Jones crossover--I wish some of that was on youtube) and as a yougn teen I admit it appealed to me and seemed different from AMC with its campus focus (though soon OLTL would--for a while--build up their campus too.

[Paul Raven]

From SOD Jan 95

CRISIS IN CORINTH

Loving - which is daytime's perpetually lowest rated soap seems to weather a major upheaval once a year - is in the midst of further serious changes.

First up - head writers Laurie McCarthy and Addie Walsh have been fired. "We opted not to pick them up",an ABC rep comments,referring to their contracts. Rumor has it that former GL writers nancy Curlee,Stephen Demorest and Patrick Mulcahy,And former AW head writer Donna Swajeski,are potential replacements. An ABC rep declined comment.

Additionally,Loving will lose young heartthrob Robert Tyler(Trucker)in Jan,and numerous set sources report that the show's two other younger leading men are thinking of leaving when their cxontracts are up next year."We never discuss contracts",a spokesperson for the shows says.

Good news:Catherine Hickland(Tess) will remain onscreen,even though she will star in the Broadway musical Les Miserables beginning Jan 17.

Throughout the upheaval,Supervising Producer Jean Dadario Burke is helming the show while Exec Producer Jo Ann Emmerich recuperates from a seroius illness."We're rudderless",laments a Loving actor.

The truth is that Loving's talented cast and crew have been the soap's saving grace this year.Reportedly,the actors often rewrite their own lines and work behind the scenes to ensure that their performances are the best they can be.Loving staffers frequently work until 9 or 10 at night,which is very unusual for a half hour show.Yet,despite their committment,Loving remains the lowest rating soap.

The logicalquestion is Will Loving be cancelled?

"ABC is committed to Loving",an ABC rep maintains. Stay tuned.